WEBVTT

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- Welcome everyone

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to The Powers of Smith and Beyond.

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My name is Isaiah Jones and I am

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the president for the
Council of Student of Colors.

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- I'm Christopher Hamann.

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I'm the outgoing vice
president of student council.

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(clapping)

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- Okay so we wanted to put together

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this event for two purposes.

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The first purpose is to
welcome the new dean,

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Ms. Marianne Yoshioka.

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(clapping)

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And then we also wanted
to set the tone for

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what the School for
Social Work is like here,

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specifically with the anti-racism mission.

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What we wanted to do was welcome back

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some dynamic alumni

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to be able to speak about their experience

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within the MSW program,

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how that was impacted by
the anti-racism mission,

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and how that also influenced
their current work.

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You guys are in for a great

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and awesome dynamic panel,

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and we just hope that
you all enjoy yourselves.

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(clapping)

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- And we just wanted to take a minute

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to announce the new council e-board

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for this next term who's here

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and I'll ask them to rise.

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Our new vice president Arianne Napier.

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Co-vice president.

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(clapping)

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Maya Hochberger-Vigsittaboot.

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Sorry. (laughs)

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(clapping)

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And Charlie Shealy.

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(clapping)

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We're so excited for them
to start the new term.

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- Some of you may not know this

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but today is actually the first day

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of Dean Yoshioka's tenure as the

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dean of the MSW program.

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We wanted to just provide time
for her to introduce herself

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and to talk briefly so you
all can get to know her.

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Dean Yoshioka?

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(clapping)

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- And we also wanted to present
with you a council t-shirt.

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- Yes.

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Thank you.

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I will wear it proudly, thank you.

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Hello everybody and I could not have had

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a better first day

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and that is in large part because of

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meeting so many of you

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and feeling the excitement
about being here.

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I could not be more delighted.

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I know that I've heard from
the buzz in the hallways

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that people are wondering
what is anti-racism?

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What does that mean to
me as the incoming dean

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and what might that mean for our program,

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and how might this look moving forward?

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I thought I would just spend a few minutes

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because I certainly don't want take

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too much time away from this great panel.

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Just to say a few things about it.

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Certainly the anti-racism
commitment at Smith

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was in very large part one
of the large draws for me

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to come to this school.

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It's significant even in across

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schools of social work in this country

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to have a school that has
a declarative statement

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and position about anti-racism

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I think is really
important and it's unique.

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I think it was for me a very large draw.

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This has been a very
significant part of my life

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personally and professionally

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and I'm looking forward
to ways to deepening it.

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Some of my reflections as I
prepared for my interviews

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and whatnot to come to this school

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was I was thinking of many ways

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I've been working in my previous positions

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from a point of sort of
inclusion or anti-oppression.

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And I've been thinking a lot about

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some of those differences

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and in fact those differences
in many ways are small,

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and not as meaningful as
the most important part

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which is to have these kinds of dialogs.

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Regularly, often and to
bring us ourselves together

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to examine the ways in which

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the different isms live in our life,

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the way that love lives in our life.

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That the ways that are intersecting

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in those intersections in
which we live so to function

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and how we can support each other.

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Both through difficult times

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that unfortunately still
are presented to us

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but also ways that we
can elevate ourselves,

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and elevate each other

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and hopefully our communities
and society as well.

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I'm deeply committed to the anti-racism

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perspective of Smith

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and I am only looking forward

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to having those conversations with you,

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and really learning other ways

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that we can find more and more ways

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to bring it to fruition across
all parts of the school,

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not just curriculum.

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Curriculum is difficult

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but in some ways I often say

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curriculum is the easier part of it,

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but really also in our process.

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The way that we treat each
other in the hallways,

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faculty process, hiring and promotion,

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admissions across the board.

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Because that to me is really
where that commitment lives.

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Without further ado I do
want to say thank you again

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for a wonderful first day.

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It could be not better

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and thank you for the shirt.

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I will wear it proudly, thanks.

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(clapping)

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- We like to just say
welcome again Dean Yoshioka

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and thank you so much.

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(clapping)

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- Now we'll get started with the panel.

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Today we will have
Kenta Asakura moderating

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and I will read his bio.

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Kenta Asakura is a 2004 graduate

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of Smith College School for Social Work.

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As an immigrant gay man of color

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he brings his own lived experience

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and social locations into
his clinical practice,

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teaching and research.

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As a doctoral candidate in social work

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at the University of Toronto,

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Kenta has published and/or presented

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on the following three substantive areas.

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One, health and well-being
among LGBTQ youth and adults.

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Two, relevance of contemporary
psychodynamic theory

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and social work practice in education.

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And three, advancing anti-racist

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and anti-oppressive commitment
in social work education.

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Kenta currently holds
adjunct faculty appointments

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at the University of Toronto

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and Smith College School for Social Work.

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He also works as a faculty field adviser

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and maintains part-time agency

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and private practice in Toronto,

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working primarily with
LGBTQ clients of color.

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Welcome and thank you.

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(clapping)

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- Thank you so much Chris for a

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lovely introduction.

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Is everybody able to hear me?

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Okay, Okay.

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Echoing quite a bit.

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Okay and I would like to
extend my warm welcome.

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It's okay.

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I like to extend my warm
welcome to Dean Yoshioka,

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to the faculty of social work.

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This has really been my second home

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really in North America

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so thank you so much for joining us.

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I'm Kenta Asakura and

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really excited to be
joining these incredible

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distinguished speakers today.

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Keshia Williams in the middle,

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Tomas Alvarez

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and Enroue Halfkenny.

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Is that right? Okay got it.

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All right. (laughs)

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This past summer I had the
privilege to be teaching

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two sections of the
racism in the U.S. courses

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and one of the things
that my co-instructor

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Roy Craft and I have been really
emphasizing to our students

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is that it's essential for all of us to be

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locating ourselves
professionally and personally

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within historical and structural context.

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Instead of actually me reading the bios

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of these three speakers,

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we decided that we're actually gonna

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ask each one of them to
do a brief introduction,

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but also be able to locate themselves

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historically and structurally

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in their respective anti-racism work.

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We are going to start with Keshia.

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- Good evening.

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My name is Keshia Williams

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and I identify as a Black African Woman

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who was born and raised in Canada

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by Caribbean and South American parents.

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That is important for
me in terms of locating

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who I am sort of racially and ethnically

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but specifically in the context
of the anti-racism mission

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understanding as well
that the construct of race

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and my racial identity and how
I've been racialized changed

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when I moved to the United
States as an immigrant here.

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I wanted to just invite in also

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sort of the complexities
of how the constructs

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are indeed located
sociohistorically, sociopolitically

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and as well among our national borders.

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- [Kenta] Tomas?

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- Hi everyone.

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My name is Tomas Alvarez III

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and I was born and raised
in California Bay Area.

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I identify as a Chicano male

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and it's important to me to also identify

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as the first of my family to

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pursue and receive a master's degree.

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That's important to me because my parents

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were the first in our family,
in both of their families

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to pursue, actually
graduate from high school

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and pursue college.

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I kind of locate, I'm
a resident of Oakland.

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To me that's home

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and it's also where I do my work

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and where my organization is based.

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That's important for me as
well to live where I work

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and to identify with that.

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- Enroue.

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- Hi, my name is Enroue
Mark Akim Halfkenny

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Onibana Shangofemi.

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I'm a multiracial Black American

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from the United States actually,

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more specifically born and
raised in Boston, Massachusetts.

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My ancestry so in addition to that is

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out of mostly Swedish, Irish,

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African of unknown specific origin,

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Micmac and Cherokee.

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With saying that I also want to honor

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and welcome all of you,

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all of your ancestors, all of your people.

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For without them and
without our own people here

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we would not be here right now,

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regardless of the complexities and

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difficulties that they have
faced and that we face,

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at least we're here now.

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And we have opportunities to be here

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that our ancestors don't have anymore.

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I also want to honor and
welcome and pay respects to

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the ancestors and the spirits of this land

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that we're on today,

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as well as all the
lands that we travel on.

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In my tradition, in the Orisha
tradition that I'm a Babalaw

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and I also want to pour libation

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to bring them here tonight

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to witness and to participate
in these conversations,

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in what we say and what we feel,

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in our bodies, in our blood,

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in our hearts, our minds and our spirits.

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With that I give thanks to
my people, to your people,

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to your people and to all, all the people

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of this place and this time.

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(singing in foreign language)

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Shay.

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- Yeah Enroue.

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Tonight we're gonna do
something a little bit different

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from a usual panel discussion.

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We have prepared three
different but related questions.

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One question for each speaker.

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The person that I'll pose the question to

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will have about six minutes

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to talk about their important work.

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Six minutes.

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(laughs)

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To facilitate a conversation then

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either or both of the other two speakers

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will have an opportunity to offer

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00:13:04.440 --> 00:13:07.910
comments and questions
and things like that.

270
00:13:07.910 --> 00:13:10.840
That would be about a few minutes

271
00:13:10.840 --> 00:13:13.380
before we move on to the next question

272
00:13:13.380 --> 00:13:15.030
for the next speaker.

273
00:13:16.550 --> 00:13:19.090
With Isaiah and Chris I've got...

274
00:13:19.090 --> 00:13:22.720
My job here is to keep
everybody on schedule.

275
00:13:22.720 --> 00:13:24.440
(laughs)

276
00:13:24.440 --> 00:13:28.430
You know the drill and
work with me on this, okay?

277
00:13:28.430 --> 00:13:30.430
(laughs)

278
00:13:31.140 --> 00:13:32.180
All right.

279
00:13:33.700 --> 00:13:36.690
We're gonna start with Keshia Williams.

280
00:13:37.340 --> 00:13:39.670
She has become one of my favorite people

281
00:13:39.670 --> 00:13:42.110
on this campus this summer really.

282
00:13:42.110 --> 00:13:44.960
It's been such a pleasure
getting to know you.

283
00:13:45.880 --> 00:13:48.680
The question that I have
for you or we have for you

284
00:13:48.680 --> 00:13:52.000
is I'm curious to hear a little bit about

285
00:13:53.290 --> 00:13:57.020
how you have been able to
build on your experience,

286
00:13:57.020 --> 00:13:59.660
personal and professional experiences

287
00:13:59.660 --> 00:14:01.940
prior to coming to Smith?

288
00:14:02.560 --> 00:14:05.570
And then how Smith anti-racism commitment

289
00:14:05.570 --> 00:14:09.470
has really informed your
professional development

290
00:14:09.470 --> 00:14:12.210
as a social worker by specifically

291
00:14:12.210 --> 00:14:14.940
now that you're moving
on to your teaching role

292
00:14:14.940 --> 00:14:17.380
as an emerging social educator.

293
00:14:17.380 --> 00:14:19.380
How has Smith anti-racism commitment

294
00:14:19.380 --> 00:14:21.300
has informed that work?

295
00:14:24.350 --> 00:14:25.830
- Six minutes and go.

296
00:14:25.830 --> 00:14:27.020
- [Kenta] Yes.

297
00:14:27.020 --> 00:14:27.860
- Okay.

298
00:14:27.860 --> 00:14:30.450
I think sort of to start,

299
00:14:30.450 --> 00:14:32.530
just as I said in terms
of how I locate myself

300
00:14:32.530 --> 00:14:33.960
I think it's also important

301
00:14:33.960 --> 00:14:35.530
sort of in talking about the personal

302
00:14:35.530 --> 00:14:39.200
and professional experience
before I landed here at Smith

303
00:14:39.200 --> 00:14:40.760
that I came to Smith,

304
00:14:40.760 --> 00:14:43.040
and I think not unlike
many students of color

305
00:14:43.040 --> 00:14:45.540
but I'll speak for my experience.

306
00:14:45.540 --> 00:14:50.540
With an analysis as well
as experience and language

307
00:14:50.770 --> 00:14:54.750
around anti-racism and sort
of racialized experiences

308
00:14:54.750 --> 00:14:57.920
and constructs around
systems of domination.

309
00:14:57.920 --> 00:15:01.120
For me specifically my experience

310
00:15:01.120 --> 00:15:02.950
working sort of before I came to Smith

311
00:15:02.950 --> 00:15:04.460
and international development

312
00:15:04.460 --> 00:15:06.230
in doing work in gender race violence

313
00:15:06.230 --> 00:15:10.460
particularly as it relates to HIV/AID

314
00:15:10.460 --> 00:15:13.970
and incidents in Latin
American and the Caribbean.

315
00:15:13.970 --> 00:15:17.810
My consciousness raising
sort of didn't happen here.

316
00:15:17.810 --> 00:15:21.070
However, the experience of coming to Smith

317
00:15:21.070 --> 00:15:23.680
was one that was I chose Smith

318
00:15:23.680 --> 00:15:25.910
because of the anti-racism commitment,

319
00:15:25.910 --> 00:15:28.750
and because for me it was
actually really important

320
00:15:28.750 --> 00:15:31.690
that at the time and I'm happy to see that

321
00:15:31.690 --> 00:15:35.550
there's also this continuing trend

322
00:15:35.550 --> 00:15:38.690
in which at the time we had a dean

323
00:15:38.690 --> 00:15:39.860
who was a woman of color,

324
00:15:39.860 --> 00:15:41.360
and that meant something for me

325
00:15:41.360 --> 00:15:42.860
in terms of making the decision

326
00:15:42.860 --> 00:15:44.950
to land here for my master's.

327
00:15:45.860 --> 00:15:49.070
In terms of how it informs
my teaching practice now

328
00:15:49.070 --> 00:15:51.340
I think there's two things I want to say

329
00:15:51.340 --> 00:15:53.670
about my experience here

330
00:15:53.670 --> 00:15:55.790
and that was one in which

331
00:15:57.010 --> 00:16:02.010
I developed a curiosity,
a desire to really engage

332
00:16:02.280 --> 00:16:05.200
with the mission when I
was here as a student.

333
00:16:06.490 --> 00:16:08.720
One place where there
was some friction for me

334
00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:12.960
was that as a student of
color oftentimes in class

335
00:16:12.960 --> 00:16:16.060
and otherwise I was called
upon to be a teacher.

336
00:16:16.060 --> 00:16:19.400
And oftentimes called upon to be a teacher

337
00:16:19.400 --> 00:16:22.800
particularly in my experience
with some White students

338
00:16:22.800 --> 00:16:25.010
who for them, sort of
their consciousness raising

339
00:16:25.010 --> 00:16:29.200
was really happening
at the time on campus.

340
00:16:29.200 --> 00:16:31.210
I had a lot of ambivalence about that.

341
00:16:31.210 --> 00:16:34.280
I think it's at the time and now

342
00:16:34.280 --> 00:16:37.320
that in order to sort of
problematize that a little bit

343
00:16:37.320 --> 00:16:41.570
the idea of replicating
this notion in which sort of

344
00:16:42.320 --> 00:16:44.760
black and brown bodies
become ones that are

345
00:16:44.760 --> 00:16:47.530
vehicles including sort
of knowledge transfer

346
00:16:47.530 --> 00:16:51.070
to be consumed by White students

347
00:16:51.070 --> 00:16:54.000
was one that I really
grappled with when I was here.

348
00:16:54.000 --> 00:16:55.900
And so this idea of being a teacher

349
00:16:55.900 --> 00:16:58.570
really was when I resisted.

350
00:16:58.570 --> 00:17:01.800
How I ended up becoming
a social educator now.

351
00:17:01.800 --> 00:17:04.510
(laughs)

352
00:17:04.510 --> 00:17:05.710
In motivational intervene

353
00:17:05.710 --> 00:17:08.480
we talk about rolling with the resistance.

354
00:17:08.480 --> 00:17:12.240
Well, I rolled a couple
ways down the hill.

355
00:17:13.350 --> 00:17:14.960
That I thought it was important

356
00:17:14.960 --> 00:17:17.760
because what I was
finding in my job search

357
00:17:17.760 --> 00:17:20.360
after graduating from Smith

358
00:17:20.360 --> 00:17:22.730
was that I long to be in organizations

359
00:17:22.730 --> 00:17:26.000
that also had some kind
of formalized commitment.

360
00:17:26.000 --> 00:17:27.840
I thought it was important that

361
00:17:27.840 --> 00:17:30.070
no matter that there were problems

362
00:17:30.070 --> 00:17:31.640
and there were definitely criticism

363
00:17:31.640 --> 00:17:34.740
of how we engaged at
the time that I was here

364
00:17:34.740 --> 00:17:35.840
in the anti-racism mission,

365
00:17:35.840 --> 00:17:37.570
and what that looked like
in terms of integrating it,

366
00:17:37.570 --> 00:17:39.180
in terms of the content

367
00:17:39.180 --> 00:17:40.680
that it was important for me

368
00:17:40.680 --> 00:17:43.320
that at least there was a
space to ask the question

369
00:17:43.320 --> 00:17:45.650
what might race have to do with this?

370
00:17:45.650 --> 00:17:47.790
That was very important to me.

371
00:17:47.790 --> 00:17:49.020
It remains important to me.

372
00:17:49.020 --> 00:17:51.630
I was finding that in my clinical work

373
00:17:51.630 --> 00:17:53.890
I was able to engage this
question relationally

374
00:17:53.890 --> 00:17:55.530
with the folks that I work with.

375
00:17:55.530 --> 00:17:58.170
The various communities,
the various clients

376
00:17:58.170 --> 00:17:59.670
and client systems

377
00:17:59.670 --> 00:18:01.830
and the biggest set of
resistance that I was finding

378
00:18:01.830 --> 00:18:03.100
was actually with my colleagues

379
00:18:03.100 --> 00:18:04.870
and some of the administrators.

380
00:18:04.870 --> 00:18:06.510
I was really challenged in that

381
00:18:06.510 --> 00:18:09.040
in terms of being both
located in a position of power

382
00:18:09.040 --> 00:18:12.440
as the clinician, right, the therapist.

383
00:18:12.440 --> 00:18:15.750
But as well sort of being
located as a therapist of color

384
00:18:15.750 --> 00:18:18.620
and sort of being told at different times

385
00:18:18.620 --> 00:18:22.310
that I was there to sort of
diversify the environment.

386
00:18:23.590 --> 00:18:26.980
For me sort of in engaging,
continuing to engage the work

387
00:18:26.980 --> 00:18:30.200
in professional development
forums and doing trainings

388
00:18:30.200 --> 00:18:31.630
because I also came with the history

389
00:18:31.630 --> 00:18:34.070
of having done sort of
diversity trainings.

390
00:18:34.070 --> 00:18:38.040
Before what happened
was oftentimes sort of

391
00:18:38.040 --> 00:18:41.410
when we were able to get
to a point of friction

392
00:18:41.410 --> 00:18:43.210
but one in which there was at least

393
00:18:43.210 --> 00:18:44.610
some engagement around,

394
00:18:44.610 --> 00:18:45.710
there would be this discussion like,

395
00:18:45.710 --> 00:18:47.350
"You know what Keshia, you know,

396
00:18:47.350 --> 00:18:48.950
"we've been trained for so many years

397
00:18:48.950 --> 00:18:52.380
"and we just can't kind of
take in this new information."

398
00:18:52.380 --> 00:18:55.190
For me the role of social
worker as gatekeeper

399
00:18:55.190 --> 00:18:57.990
became one that was a salient observation

400
00:18:57.990 --> 00:19:00.260
in my professional experience.

401
00:19:00.260 --> 00:19:02.260
My commitment then became okay,

402
00:19:02.260 --> 00:19:07.260
so I can have a caseload of 30, 35 clients

403
00:19:07.510 --> 00:19:08.670
and I can do the best work

404
00:19:08.670 --> 00:19:11.410
and do really, really
good work in the room.

405
00:19:11.410 --> 00:19:14.410
And yet here are these
structures that aren't shifting

406
00:19:14.410 --> 00:19:16.440
and here I am being depleted,

407
00:19:16.440 --> 00:19:18.850
and not having anything left

408
00:19:18.850 --> 00:19:20.830
for the places that nourish me.

409
00:19:21.620 --> 00:19:23.920
What is a way that I can
continue on in this work

410
00:19:23.920 --> 00:19:25.790
rather than having to leave the work

411
00:19:25.790 --> 00:19:28.290
that will also leave a legacy

412
00:19:28.290 --> 00:19:30.820
that can continue to grow, right?

413
00:19:30.820 --> 00:19:33.590
That this work is not
just mine to shoulder.

414
00:19:33.590 --> 00:19:36.500
The way I see moving into sort of

415
00:19:36.500 --> 00:19:38.990
the role of social work educator became

416
00:19:38.990 --> 00:19:42.870
well, it seems to be that
occupying a place of power

417
00:19:42.870 --> 00:19:45.070
as an instructor will then allow me

418
00:19:45.070 --> 00:19:47.170
to train the gatekeepers.

419
00:19:47.170 --> 00:19:49.410
If they're getting some training

420
00:19:49.410 --> 00:19:52.750
in being able to integrate these ideas,

421
00:19:52.750 --> 00:19:56.980
particularly sort of one of the
values I think for Smith was

422
00:19:56.980 --> 00:19:59.320
in being able to have language

423
00:19:59.320 --> 00:20:01.790
to be able to meet clinicians
where they were at.

424
00:20:01.790 --> 00:20:03.660
The story I tell sometimes is

425
00:20:03.660 --> 00:20:05.360
that when I have the privilege to travel

426
00:20:05.360 --> 00:20:07.760
one of my commitments is
that I always at least learn

427
00:20:07.760 --> 00:20:10.330
the greeting of wherever
I am traveling to.

428
00:20:10.330 --> 00:20:13.170
I think it's important in
the way that we conceptualize

429
00:20:13.170 --> 00:20:16.160
how we can actively participate in

430
00:20:16.160 --> 00:20:18.470
our own humanization as well as others.

431
00:20:18.470 --> 00:20:21.640
And so for me, how was I
going to meet these clinicians

432
00:20:21.640 --> 00:20:24.310
who are particularly resistant
to some of these ideas

433
00:20:24.310 --> 00:20:26.110
and particularly weighing on this idea

434
00:20:26.110 --> 00:20:27.750
that they had been trained a long time ago

435
00:20:27.750 --> 00:20:30.080
and that that was entrenched.

436
00:20:30.080 --> 00:20:31.890
Smith I think really empowered me

437
00:20:31.890 --> 00:20:34.780
with the clinical language
that was paired with

438
00:20:34.780 --> 00:20:37.060
sort of this perspective
around anti-racism

439
00:20:37.060 --> 00:20:39.030
which I also think is important around

440
00:20:39.030 --> 00:20:41.230
how I use that from an
intersectional approach.

441
00:20:41.230 --> 00:20:43.430
Even if we're talking
about disability justice,

442
00:20:43.430 --> 00:20:46.130
even when we're talking
about gendered perspectives

443
00:20:46.130 --> 00:20:48.800
and critiquing that, that the
question can still be asked,

444
00:20:48.800 --> 00:20:51.240
well, what does race have to do with this?

445
00:20:51.240 --> 00:20:53.440
For me bringing that into the classroom

446
00:20:53.440 --> 00:20:57.340
to be able to engage
pedagogically speaking

447
00:20:57.340 --> 00:21:00.110
was a place that was, you know,

448
00:21:00.110 --> 00:21:03.280
at least so lower stakes
than an employment situation,

449
00:21:03.280 --> 00:21:04.750
and a place where I felt like

450
00:21:04.750 --> 00:21:07.090
if I've got 25 students in a classroom

451
00:21:07.090 --> 00:21:10.190
and I'm encouraging them to
play with some of these ideas

452
00:21:10.190 --> 00:21:12.820
in a way that we can contain that space.

453
00:21:12.820 --> 00:21:14.660
And containing it does not mean that

454
00:21:14.660 --> 00:21:17.360
there's not disruption or friction, right?

455
00:21:17.360 --> 00:21:18.530
But then we can do that from a place

456
00:21:18.530 --> 00:21:19.560
of liberation and love

457
00:21:19.560 --> 00:21:21.600
which I know Enroue's gonna talk about.

458
00:21:21.600 --> 00:21:24.200
Then this is then a breeding ground I felt

459
00:21:24.200 --> 00:21:25.610
that could then ripple out.

460
00:21:25.610 --> 00:21:30.210
Those 25 students who now
have a caseload of 35 clients

461
00:21:30.210 --> 00:21:31.540
who are now 35 clients

462
00:21:31.540 --> 00:21:33.580
who are going back into their communities,

463
00:21:33.580 --> 00:21:35.920
and able to be people who can participate

464
00:21:35.920 --> 00:21:37.780
in the co-creation of their healing

465
00:21:37.780 --> 00:21:39.550
and therefore their community's healing

466
00:21:39.550 --> 00:21:41.970
was my way of feeling like

467
00:21:41.970 --> 00:21:44.660
this ambivalence I had
about being a teacher

468
00:21:44.660 --> 00:21:49.130
was one that I could engage
as a form of social justice.

469
00:21:49.130 --> 00:21:50.810
And so that's how I got here.

470
00:21:52.500 --> 00:21:57.490
(clapping)

471
00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:02.800
- Thank you so much.

472
00:22:02.800 --> 00:22:06.310
Does either Tomas or Enroue have

473
00:22:06.310 --> 00:22:10.300
comment to follow or question rather?

474
00:22:11.450 --> 00:22:14.300
- I have a comment and a question.

475
00:22:15.220 --> 00:22:17.880
First one I commend you for

476
00:22:17.880 --> 00:22:21.230
having the courage to take
a none, quote, unquote,

477
00:22:21.230 --> 00:22:23.400
a non-traditional path for

478
00:22:23.400 --> 00:22:27.330
coming to a school that is most known for

479
00:22:27.330 --> 00:22:30.600
a clinical practice or application.

480
00:22:30.600 --> 00:22:33.260
And I think that that's important

481
00:22:34.040 --> 00:22:36.240
because there are many avenues

482
00:22:36.240 --> 00:22:38.160
where we can have an impact.

483
00:22:39.610 --> 00:22:43.150
I just wanted to hear more about that,

484
00:22:43.150 --> 00:22:45.340
about that decision that you made

485
00:22:45.340 --> 00:22:50.340
and really the rationale and
where you see it leading,

486
00:22:50.620 --> 00:22:54.210
and how you see it having an impact

487
00:22:55.360 --> 00:22:57.141
for the field at large.

488
00:23:00.370 --> 00:23:03.920
- And now with less than
six minutes. (laughs)

489
00:23:05.770 --> 00:23:08.210
Where do I see social
work education having

490
00:23:08.210 --> 00:23:10.980
an impact in a non-traditional way?

491
00:23:10.980 --> 00:23:14.410
- We focus on service
provision directly with clients

492
00:23:14.410 --> 00:23:16.080
but you know, what about the people

493
00:23:16.080 --> 00:23:17.050
who work with those clients

494
00:23:17.050 --> 00:23:19.790
or the people who as you
called the gatekeepers

495
00:23:19.790 --> 00:23:22.220
who create policy, who, you know?

496
00:23:22.220 --> 00:23:25.230
There's tremendous amounts
of work to be done there

497
00:23:25.230 --> 00:23:28.000
and I'd love to hear
more about your vision.

498
00:23:28.000 --> 00:23:30.660
- Yeah, I mean I think
it's again this idea

499
00:23:30.660 --> 00:23:32.770
of sort of translation, right?

500
00:23:32.770 --> 00:23:36.030
That I think for me at
least how I see my role

501
00:23:36.030 --> 00:23:39.050
in impacting sort of
the various stakeholders

502
00:23:39.050 --> 00:23:43.780
in our work is the entry points, right?

503
00:23:43.780 --> 00:23:45.570
Because sometimes my experience has been

504
00:23:45.570 --> 00:23:48.570
the hardest thing is to
get to the table, right?

505
00:23:49.080 --> 00:23:51.900
That the entry point is how
am I gonna get to the table

506
00:23:51.900 --> 00:23:53.390
which means having to learn a lot about

507
00:23:53.390 --> 00:23:55.850
what the position of the stakeholders are,

508
00:23:55.850 --> 00:23:58.780
and how they understand
or don't understand

509
00:23:58.780 --> 00:24:01.160
a perspective that is
sort of as you called it

510
00:24:01.160 --> 00:24:03.730
non-traditional fitting into

511
00:24:03.730 --> 00:24:07.000
with limitations to how that can be seen.

512
00:24:07.000 --> 00:24:11.540
My vision is if I am sort
of instructing students

513
00:24:11.540 --> 00:24:13.370
who will then go out and become

514
00:24:13.370 --> 00:24:15.340
the various kinds of stakeholders

515
00:24:15.340 --> 00:24:17.710
and potentially even be teaching,

516
00:24:17.710 --> 00:24:20.570
again, that there is a role that I play

517
00:24:20.570 --> 00:24:23.380
that again does not center the instructor

518
00:24:23.380 --> 00:24:27.250
or the clinicians as the person
with all of the knowledge

519
00:24:27.250 --> 00:24:30.810
and ability to create change.

520
00:24:30.810 --> 00:24:33.490
The way I see change,
the way I see healing

521
00:24:33.490 --> 00:24:35.560
is a collective process.

522
00:24:35.560 --> 00:24:37.430
From that entry point

523
00:24:37.430 --> 00:24:40.090
even though teaching is a
very specific entry point

524
00:24:40.090 --> 00:24:43.820
that it allows me the vision to

525
00:24:43.820 --> 00:24:46.540
understand the diversity of
who's in the room as well

526
00:24:46.540 --> 00:24:47.710
and they're various interests

527
00:24:47.710 --> 00:24:49.510
and where they'll be going out to.

528
00:24:49.510 --> 00:24:51.810
I guess I see it more as
sort of planting the seeds

529
00:24:51.810 --> 00:24:55.480
and that is really important to be able to

530
00:24:55.480 --> 00:24:57.580
nourish that portion of it.

531
00:24:57.580 --> 00:24:59.220
And I'm sort of reminded of

532
00:24:59.220 --> 00:25:01.850
I have this quote in my office

533
00:25:01.850 --> 00:25:05.030
and it's sort of the
honorable Dalai Lama says

534
00:25:05.030 --> 00:25:06.430
to sort of this group of monks

535
00:25:06.430 --> 00:25:08.320
who've been working really, really hard,

536
00:25:08.320 --> 00:25:10.430
meditating really hard and they talk about

537
00:25:10.430 --> 00:25:12.270
there's still all these
suffering in the world.

538
00:25:12.270 --> 00:25:13.570
And we've been working really hard

539
00:25:13.570 --> 00:25:15.640
and we're feeling this despair.

540
00:25:15.640 --> 00:25:18.710
And so the Dalai Lama says
to this group of monks,

541
00:25:18.710 --> 00:25:20.410
"Do not despair.

542
00:25:20.410 --> 00:25:23.840
"Your work will bear
fruit in 700 years or so."

543
00:25:23.840 --> 00:25:26.210
(laughs)

544
00:25:26.210 --> 00:25:28.350
I feel encouraged by that.

545
00:25:28.350 --> 00:25:29.750
(laughs)

546
00:25:29.750 --> 00:25:33.250
In the boundlessness of our work and time

547
00:25:33.250 --> 00:25:37.090
not having to be limited to
sort of this particular moment

548
00:25:37.090 --> 00:25:40.210
and this particular moment
is centered around me.

549
00:25:40.210 --> 00:25:42.230
I hope that that's helpful.

550
00:25:42.230 --> 00:25:43.550
- Very helpful.

551
00:25:44.130 --> 00:25:45.020
- Actually I'd like to make

552
00:25:45.020 --> 00:25:46.600
one comment.
- [Kenta] Please. Yeah.

553
00:25:46.600 --> 00:25:48.730
- [Enroue] Where you reminded me of is

554
00:25:48.730 --> 00:25:50.270
there's another saying where

555
00:25:50.270 --> 00:25:52.940
like what's the perfect
time to plant a tree?

556
00:25:52.940 --> 00:25:55.240
And it's 20 or 30 years ago.

557
00:25:55.240 --> 00:25:56.340
What's the next perfect time?

558
00:25:56.340 --> 00:25:57.810
Right now.

559
00:25:57.810 --> 00:26:00.950
That really speaks to it's always now.

560
00:26:00.950 --> 00:26:04.580
It's always you, what you're doing.

561
00:26:04.580 --> 00:26:05.430
So thank you.

562
00:26:05.430 --> 00:26:06.870
- [Keshia] Thank you.
- [Enroue] Yeah.

563
00:26:07.450 --> 00:26:10.990
- [Kenta] It's a perfect segue for Tomas.

564
00:26:10.990 --> 00:26:15.360
Our question for Tomas which
is about your work right now.

565
00:26:15.360 --> 00:26:16.690
Since you graduated,

566
00:26:16.690 --> 00:26:19.670
I think that you graduated
a couple years after I did.

567
00:26:19.670 --> 00:26:21.830
I think during the time
that you are at Smith

568
00:26:21.830 --> 00:26:26.610
you started a very interesting
important organization.

569
00:26:26.610 --> 00:26:28.740
My question for you is

570
00:26:28.740 --> 00:26:33.210
how has Smith anti-racism
commitment facilitated

571
00:26:33.210 --> 00:26:36.750
your development of your
non-profit organization

572
00:26:36.750 --> 00:26:40.570
and work with important
work with youth of color?

573
00:26:42.960 --> 00:26:45.610
- Feeling that pressure
of the six minutes.

574
00:26:50.060 --> 00:26:52.200
First I just want to say
I'm happy to be here.

575
00:26:52.200 --> 00:26:53.930
I really am.

576
00:26:53.930 --> 00:26:57.400
Smith has provided me with a tremendous

577
00:26:57.400 --> 00:27:01.320
educational opportunity,
relational opportunities.

578
00:27:02.140 --> 00:27:05.670
In fact, I did my thesis
presentation in this exact room

579
00:27:05.670 --> 00:27:07.910
on Hip Hop Therapy,

580
00:27:07.910 --> 00:27:11.550
which I had the privilege
to be able to pilot here

581
00:27:11.550 --> 00:27:13.450
as a first year MSW student.

582
00:27:13.450 --> 00:27:16.160
It was a part of my
community practice project

583
00:27:16.160 --> 00:27:18.590
which grew into my master's thesis,

584
00:27:18.590 --> 00:27:20.630
which I graduated in '06,

585
00:27:20.630 --> 00:27:24.730
has since grown into a 501(c)(3)
non-profit organization

586
00:27:24.730 --> 00:27:26.770
administering Hip Hop Therapy programs

587
00:27:26.770 --> 00:27:28.470
throughout the Bay Area,

588
00:27:28.470 --> 00:27:32.710
as well as other innovative
mental health service

589
00:27:32.710 --> 00:27:35.430
provision activities.

590
00:27:36.920 --> 00:27:41.920
I really credit it back
to my experience here.

591
00:27:44.230 --> 00:27:45.820
Even prior to getting to Smith

592
00:27:45.820 --> 00:27:47.190
I'm glad that you named that.

593
00:27:47.190 --> 00:27:49.320
One of the concepts that
was introduced to me here

594
00:27:49.320 --> 00:27:51.160
is this notion of use of self

595
00:27:51.160 --> 00:27:53.950
and how we use ourselves in our practice.

596
00:27:53.950 --> 00:27:56.030
It really allowed me to think back to

597
00:27:56.030 --> 00:27:58.400
my own experience before Smith

598
00:27:58.400 --> 00:28:01.470
around community organizing,

599
00:28:03.310 --> 00:28:05.330
my experience as a man of color,

600
00:28:05.330 --> 00:28:08.590
my affinity for boys
and young men of color.

601
00:28:10.550 --> 00:28:13.310
Really thinking about
how I can kind of combine

602
00:28:13.310 --> 00:28:15.450
my interest and my passion.

603
00:28:15.450 --> 00:28:17.380
My interest and passion for hip hop

604
00:28:17.380 --> 00:28:21.020
with my interest and passion
for working with adolescents

605
00:28:21.020 --> 00:28:23.820
specifically boys and young men of color

606
00:28:23.820 --> 00:28:26.610
around healing and development.

607
00:28:27.420 --> 00:28:32.420
I think really having supportive peers,

608
00:28:33.530 --> 00:28:38.530
supportive professors but
more importantly the space.

609
00:28:38.670 --> 00:28:40.670
There's tremendous amounts of space here

610
00:28:40.670 --> 00:28:42.180
and if you're a student here

611
00:28:42.180 --> 00:28:45.740
you know that it's a social
work immersion program.

612
00:28:45.740 --> 00:28:49.750
You're eating, sleeping, dreaming

613
00:28:49.750 --> 00:28:52.380
social work theory, right?

614
00:28:52.380 --> 00:28:55.360
And you're practicing
on each other, right?

615
00:28:55.360 --> 00:28:58.060
What you're learning on
yourself and on each other.

616
00:28:58.060 --> 00:29:02.300
I think that's specifically
around the anti-racism mission

617
00:29:02.300 --> 00:29:05.860
for me I felt incredibly
proud to be at a school

618
00:29:05.860 --> 00:29:07.840
that prioritized that.

619
00:29:07.840 --> 00:29:11.840
And not just in form
of a mission statement,

620
00:29:11.840 --> 00:29:15.510
but had ongoing conversations
at multiple levels

621
00:29:15.510 --> 00:29:18.140
about how you operationalize
a mission statement.

622
00:29:18.140 --> 00:29:21.510
As somebody who has
constructed a mission statement

623
00:29:21.510 --> 00:29:24.080
that grew our of a single
therapeutic program

624
00:29:24.080 --> 00:29:26.550
that is now charged with a task of

625
00:29:26.550 --> 00:29:29.490
having to operationalize
that mission vision

626
00:29:29.490 --> 00:29:34.490
and those values into
programs and policies

627
00:29:34.490 --> 00:29:37.800
and procedures and how we
support and train staff,

628
00:29:37.800 --> 00:29:40.070
but also how we stay true to this notion

629
00:29:40.070 --> 00:29:43.880
that communities know what they need best.

630
00:29:44.470 --> 00:29:46.110
There's already ways in which,

631
00:29:46.110 --> 00:29:50.080
I like what you said about
not centralizing ourselves

632
00:29:50.080 --> 00:29:53.000
because we have the
degree or the education.

633
00:29:54.110 --> 00:29:55.320
I created hip hop,

634
00:29:55.320 --> 00:29:56.920
I piloted a Hip Hop Therapy program

635
00:29:56.920 --> 00:30:00.490
but I often say, one of the
country's first in 2004,

636
00:30:00.490 --> 00:30:03.520
but I always say wherever I present that

637
00:30:03.520 --> 00:30:06.860
young people in communities
across this country

638
00:30:06.860 --> 00:30:10.290
had been using hip hop as a
naturally cathartic outlet,

639
00:30:10.290 --> 00:30:12.560
as a natural outlet for
therapy for decades.

640
00:30:12.560 --> 00:30:13.900
For over 40 years now,

641
00:30:13.900 --> 00:30:17.400
hip hop is a community-defined strategy

642
00:30:17.400 --> 00:30:19.140
to wellness and to well-being.

643
00:30:19.140 --> 00:30:22.740
All I did was formalize
it and give it a name

644
00:30:22.740 --> 00:30:25.850
and so did other people
around this time period.

645
00:30:25.850 --> 00:30:30.850
But that doesn't make me the
center of the conversation

646
00:30:31.240 --> 00:30:33.950
around how do we part as providers,

647
00:30:33.950 --> 00:30:36.359
as individual providers
in systems of care,

648
00:30:36.359 --> 00:30:38.860
how do we partner with communities

649
00:30:38.860 --> 00:30:42.430
and not simply see them
as consumers or clients,

650
00:30:42.430 --> 00:30:44.230
right, of a service?

651
00:30:44.230 --> 00:30:46.320
But how do we truly partner with them

652
00:30:46.320 --> 00:30:47.530
and build upon the ways

653
00:30:47.530 --> 00:30:49.600
that they've already identified

654
00:30:49.600 --> 00:30:51.230
to help and heal themselves.

655
00:30:51.230 --> 00:30:53.670
That's the mission of our organization,

656
00:30:53.670 --> 00:30:56.340
really the vision of the
organization is health equity

657
00:30:56.340 --> 00:30:58.450
and how do we achieve health equity

658
00:30:58.450 --> 00:31:00.510
without partnering with communities

659
00:31:00.510 --> 00:31:05.050
and meaningful substantial ways?

660
00:31:05.050 --> 00:31:09.860
I think that a lot of
that wouldn't have...

661
00:31:09.860 --> 00:31:11.400
I wouldn't have been able to do a lot

662
00:31:11.400 --> 00:31:13.290
that I've been able to do
over the last 10 years,

663
00:31:13.290 --> 00:31:15.630
obviously without the support of our staff

664
00:31:15.630 --> 00:31:17.960
which we have a lot of
Smithies I'm proud to say

665
00:31:17.960 --> 00:31:20.230
that work for our organization,

666
00:31:20.230 --> 00:31:22.470
but also with our young people.

667
00:31:22.470 --> 00:31:25.240
We've developed, we're a
community-based organization

668
00:31:25.240 --> 00:31:27.140
rooted in Oakland, California

669
00:31:27.140 --> 00:31:32.140
that has developed a
community-defined practice, right.

670
00:31:32.380 --> 00:31:33.310
And what does mean?

671
00:31:33.310 --> 00:31:36.750
You can only do that in
partnership with community.

672
00:31:36.750 --> 00:31:38.420
We have an evolution.

673
00:31:38.420 --> 00:31:41.550
Our Hip Hop Therapy model
has evolved over the years

674
00:31:41.550 --> 00:31:46.550
to the first model was
co-facilitated by a clinician, myself

675
00:31:47.330 --> 00:31:49.350
in partnership with a teaching artist,

676
00:31:49.350 --> 00:31:51.160
a good friend of mine.

677
00:31:51.160 --> 00:31:55.340
That model has evolved
to include an alumni now

678
00:31:55.340 --> 00:31:58.370
of our program that
functions as a peer mentor.

679
00:31:58.370 --> 00:32:01.340
We're training young adults in Oakland

680
00:32:01.340 --> 00:32:04.580
to be helpers, healers, change makers.

681
00:32:04.580 --> 00:32:05.610
That's what I mean when I say

682
00:32:05.610 --> 00:32:07.910
we've developed this
community-defined practice.

683
00:32:07.910 --> 00:32:09.220
It's not...

684
00:32:09.220 --> 00:32:10.750
The clinicians alone
couldn't have done it,

685
00:32:10.750 --> 00:32:12.250
the teaching artist from the community

686
00:32:12.250 --> 00:32:13.210
couldn't have done it.

687
00:32:13.210 --> 00:32:15.760
Young people from the
community without the support

688
00:32:15.760 --> 00:32:17.180
of folks like us couldn't have done it.

689
00:32:17.180 --> 00:32:19.830
We can't do it without the
support that we receive

690
00:32:19.830 --> 00:32:21.730
from foundations, from systems of care,

691
00:32:21.730 --> 00:32:23.300
from individual donors.

692
00:32:23.300 --> 00:32:25.770
Really we're looking
at how do we transcend

693
00:32:25.770 --> 00:32:30.360
the notion of a system of
care into a community of care.

694
00:32:30.360 --> 00:32:31.870
I think that here you have

695
00:32:31.870 --> 00:32:33.870
a tremendous amount of community

696
00:32:33.870 --> 00:32:35.840
and you have these conversations that

697
00:32:35.840 --> 00:32:38.340
spill outside of the classroom.

698
00:32:39.190 --> 00:32:43.390
It's that process that is so enriching

699
00:32:43.390 --> 00:32:47.150
that for me really
created the space to think

700
00:32:47.150 --> 00:32:49.860
and re-imagine what
therapy could look like,

701
00:32:49.860 --> 00:32:53.220
what mental health service
provision could look like.

702
00:32:53.220 --> 00:32:55.380
I'm wondering how much time I have.

703
00:32:56.860 --> 00:32:59.240
Three minutes, great, wow!

704
00:32:59.870 --> 00:33:01.230
Let me loosen up.

705
00:33:01.230 --> 00:33:04.070
(laughs)

706
00:33:04.070 --> 00:33:05.290
Yes.

707
00:33:06.640 --> 00:33:09.910
Again, I think it's great.

708
00:33:09.910 --> 00:33:13.440
I think what Smith is
continuing to do is great

709
00:33:13.440 --> 00:33:16.750
because again, we can have
fancy mission statements.

710
00:33:16.750 --> 00:33:20.350
But how do we operationalize
those mission statements?

711
00:33:20.350 --> 00:33:24.820
How do we revisit and reexamine

712
00:33:24.820 --> 00:33:27.360
whether or not we're reaching our goal?

713
00:33:27.360 --> 00:33:29.600
If you look at that mission
statement specifically,

714
00:33:29.600 --> 00:33:31.130
I don't know if it's
evolved since I was here

715
00:33:31.130 --> 00:33:35.120
but it said a commitment
to the process of becoming.

716
00:33:35.760 --> 00:33:36.600
Right?

717
00:33:36.600 --> 00:33:39.640
That's not saying that
they've arrived, right?

718
00:33:39.640 --> 00:33:43.310
We're gonna spend decades trying to arrive

719
00:33:43.310 --> 00:33:45.880
and we'll probably never arrive, right?

720
00:33:45.880 --> 00:33:48.590
So how do we then commit ourselves

721
00:33:48.590 --> 00:33:50.150
as people who are gonna try to go out

722
00:33:50.150 --> 00:33:53.750
and help communities to the process

723
00:33:53.750 --> 00:33:57.120
of becoming more informed,

724
00:33:57.120 --> 00:33:59.330
more effective but more sensitive,

725
00:33:59.330 --> 00:34:04.330
but not perpetuate these,

726
00:34:05.370 --> 00:34:08.710
these dynamics that position the provider

727
00:34:08.710 --> 00:34:10.980
as the sole expert in the room.

728
00:34:12.240 --> 00:34:16.240
Having the conversations
around systems of oppression

729
00:34:16.240 --> 00:34:19.100
and how that translates into

730
00:34:19.100 --> 00:34:20.280
the mental health industry

731
00:34:20.280 --> 00:34:22.520
which is inherently pathology-based.

732
00:34:22.520 --> 00:34:24.210
It's inherently pathology-based

733
00:34:24.210 --> 00:34:26.590
and we're learning to
work inside of that system

734
00:34:26.590 --> 00:34:28.050
so it's our job.

735
00:34:28.050 --> 00:34:30.390
In many cases it's our job to prescribe

736
00:34:30.390 --> 00:34:34.080
a pathology to an individual
to prescribe treatment

737
00:34:34.800 --> 00:34:36.830
and to administer that treatment,

738
00:34:36.830 --> 00:34:38.870
and how does that not perpetuate

739
00:34:38.870 --> 00:34:42.120
a system of a pathology
of marginalization?

740
00:34:43.170 --> 00:34:45.730
It's hard because in many
cases our hands become tied

741
00:34:45.730 --> 00:34:49.680
especially if we want to get
reimbursement for that service.

742
00:34:49.680 --> 00:34:52.150
Organizations, the way
organizations are set up

743
00:34:52.150 --> 00:34:55.720
if you're drawing reimbursement dollars

744
00:34:55.720 --> 00:34:58.610
you're inherently perpetuating
this marginalization

745
00:34:58.610 --> 00:35:02.320
and pathology, pathology.

746
00:35:02.320 --> 00:35:05.430
Pathology (laugh)

747
00:35:05.430 --> 00:35:07.690
amongst our already
marginalized communities.

748
00:35:07.690 --> 00:35:09.300
And so, there's ways that it happens

749
00:35:09.300 --> 00:35:11.700
that are subtle, that are individual

750
00:35:11.700 --> 00:35:13.330
but also that are systemic

751
00:35:13.330 --> 00:35:16.160
and we are a part of those systems.

752
00:35:16.160 --> 00:35:19.140
I think, I encourage you
if you're a student here,

753
00:35:19.140 --> 00:35:21.670
have those conversations about how

754
00:35:21.670 --> 00:35:25.140
you're going to use yourself

755
00:35:25.140 --> 00:35:27.850
and your unique lived experience.

756
00:35:27.850 --> 00:35:32.720
How do you want to practice in community?

757
00:35:32.720 --> 00:35:34.750
Especially if you're gonna
practicing in communities

758
00:35:34.750 --> 00:35:37.810
that don't look like you, right?

759
00:35:38.490 --> 00:35:40.780
And so, my time is up.

760
00:35:42.160 --> 00:35:43.080
Yeah.

761
00:35:43.080 --> 00:35:44.630
- Okay, thanks Tomas.

762
00:35:44.630 --> 00:35:49.630
(clapping)

763
00:35:52.820 --> 00:35:55.960
Does either of you have
a comment or question?

764
00:35:57.300 --> 00:36:00.870
- I have a question but first also

765
00:36:00.870 --> 00:36:04.250
really appreciating not just the

766
00:36:04.250 --> 00:36:06.930
kind of work that you're
doing but really generosity

767
00:36:07.750 --> 00:36:12.360
that you have for how
you moved in your life

768
00:36:12.360 --> 00:36:14.330
to kind of come to this place.

769
00:36:14.330 --> 00:36:17.000
Actually that ties in with, you know,

770
00:36:17.000 --> 00:36:18.460
here at Smith there's so much

771
00:36:18.460 --> 00:36:19.830
and in kind of mental health field,

772
00:36:19.830 --> 00:36:22.260
there's so much focus on you're in a room

773
00:36:22.260 --> 00:36:24.960
with an individual or
a couple or a family,

774
00:36:24.960 --> 00:36:26.240
and there's kind of a set of what

775
00:36:26.240 --> 00:36:28.600
your understanding of
that outcome might be.

776
00:36:28.600 --> 00:36:30.910
But with a community or what
I'm actually curious about

777
00:36:30.910 --> 00:36:34.080
what is your understanding of what those

778
00:36:34.080 --> 00:36:36.050
outcomes might be working
with the community

779
00:36:36.050 --> 00:36:40.340
versus these individuals,
couples and families?

780
00:36:47.320 --> 00:36:50.530
- I have to look at the, let's say client.

781
00:36:50.530 --> 00:36:53.570
The client is not just the young person.

782
00:36:53.570 --> 00:36:56.940
I also see it as the community
at large in the system

783
00:36:56.940 --> 00:37:01.100
and even the word client I
have a resistance to that

784
00:37:01.100 --> 00:37:03.980
but really it's looking
at how to have an impact

785
00:37:03.980 --> 00:37:06.730
at those three levels
and what needs to happen.

786
00:37:06.730 --> 00:37:09.620
In terms of outcomes, the
outcomes that I'm looking at,

787
00:37:10.440 --> 00:37:11.820
homicide is the leading cause of death

788
00:37:11.820 --> 00:37:13.831
among young people in Oakland.

789
00:37:14.810 --> 00:37:16.950
When you look at the health disparities,

790
00:37:16.950 --> 00:37:20.560
the social, the academic
disparities faced,

791
00:37:20.560 --> 00:37:24.550
it's clear who is being impacted the most.

792
00:37:25.730 --> 00:37:29.800
Specifically with homicide,
that's a mental health issue.

793
00:37:29.800 --> 00:37:32.220
In my opinion that's
a mental health issue.

794
00:37:33.040 --> 00:37:36.730
There's such a high rate of trauma

795
00:37:37.440 --> 00:37:41.810
and educators and even
mental health providers

796
00:37:41.810 --> 00:37:46.810
are ill-equipped to deal
with the trauma in Oakland.

797
00:37:46.840 --> 00:37:49.370
There's this saying that,
you know, we had a vigil

798
00:37:50.130 --> 00:37:51.790
this summer, a community vigil,

799
00:37:51.790 --> 00:37:53.390
and we had this banner

800
00:37:53.390 --> 00:37:55.190
and we spray painted on the banner,

801
00:37:55.190 --> 00:37:59.540
it takes a community to heal a community.

802
00:38:00.800 --> 00:38:03.740
In the way I see myself in that

803
00:38:03.740 --> 00:38:06.170
and the way that our
organization sees itself in that

804
00:38:06.170 --> 00:38:09.080
which is comprised of
clinicians, teaching artists

805
00:38:09.080 --> 00:38:13.480
and young adults that live
and come from that community,

806
00:38:13.480 --> 00:38:16.780
is that we are facilitators of that

807
00:38:16.780 --> 00:38:18.950
or we can be, we strive to be.

808
00:38:20.840 --> 00:38:24.010
But we can only facilitate, you know?

809
00:38:25.160 --> 00:38:28.360
I think that in terms of the outcome,

810
00:38:28.360 --> 00:38:31.280
the vision is a community of care.

811
00:38:32.230 --> 00:38:36.930
I always point to the success
story of one our alumni

812
00:38:36.930 --> 00:38:39.270
who's in our Beats, Rhymes
and Life academy program

813
00:38:39.270 --> 00:38:42.410
which is a social work pipeline
program for young folks

814
00:38:42.410 --> 00:38:45.610
who are alumni of our
Hip Hop Therapy program.

815
00:38:45.610 --> 00:38:48.330
He's become the counselor
in his neighborhood.

816
00:38:49.350 --> 00:38:50.820
When his friends have a problem,

817
00:38:50.820 --> 00:38:53.570
he's 23 years old, they come to him.

818
00:38:54.350 --> 00:38:56.290
That's without, that's not formalized.

819
00:38:56.290 --> 00:38:58.020
That's without a system,

820
00:38:58.020 --> 00:38:59.430
right but that's what we want

821
00:38:59.430 --> 00:39:04.100
and that's what it's going
to take to heal my community,

822
00:39:04.100 --> 00:39:08.600
is to equip and support
the community's capacity,

823
00:39:08.600 --> 00:39:11.540
own capacity to help and heal themselves.

824
00:39:11.540 --> 00:39:13.200
We have a role to play in that

825
00:39:13.200 --> 00:39:16.140
and it's not a top down
approach that's gonna do it.

826
00:39:16.140 --> 00:39:18.010
Because what we know as
we've taken that approach

827
00:39:18.010 --> 00:39:22.110
for several decades and
it's had limited results,

828
00:39:22.110 --> 00:39:25.280
and those results have
not been long lasting.

829
00:39:25.280 --> 00:39:26.790
To me that's the outcome.

830
00:39:26.790 --> 00:39:31.720
The outcome we measure
success by our academy.

831
00:39:31.720 --> 00:39:34.530
Are they going out and being leaders

832
00:39:34.530 --> 00:39:37.810
and helpers and healers
in their community?

833
00:39:38.660 --> 00:39:41.470
Whether or not thy choose
to become a social worker

834
00:39:41.470 --> 00:39:43.870
or clinician or go to the formal education

835
00:39:43.870 --> 00:39:46.020
doesn't mean that they cannot be a healer.

836
00:39:47.040 --> 00:39:48.640
To me that's the outcome.

837
00:39:48.640 --> 00:39:50.760
That's the way that we measure success.

838
00:39:52.680 --> 00:39:54.040
- I have, is there time?

839
00:39:54.040 --> 00:39:54.910
- Yeah.

840
00:39:54.910 --> 00:39:59.250
(clapping)

841
00:39:59.250 --> 00:40:01.430
Keshia go ahead, yeah.

842
00:40:01.430 --> 00:40:04.650
- That was a really important piece to me

843
00:40:04.650 --> 00:40:07.530
in terms of hearing
particularly in the naming of

844
00:40:07.530 --> 00:40:10.900
trauma and what community
healing looks like.

845
00:40:10.900 --> 00:40:13.880
I wondered if you could comment on

846
00:40:15.200 --> 00:40:17.170
sort of in trauma-informed care.

847
00:40:17.170 --> 00:40:21.870
The way that sort of the
discourse goes right now

848
00:40:21.870 --> 00:40:24.110
there's a lot of talk about self care

849
00:40:24.110 --> 00:40:26.950
which of course we know is important.

850
00:40:26.950 --> 00:40:31.020
What I don't hear as much
talk about is community care

851
00:40:31.020 --> 00:40:32.520
and what that looks like.

852
00:40:32.520 --> 00:40:34.890
It sounds like what
you're talking about too

853
00:40:34.890 --> 00:40:38.960
is being able to provide the facilitation

854
00:40:38.960 --> 00:40:42.260
for the young people to be able to provide

855
00:40:42.260 --> 00:40:44.700
care for themselves and
for their communities.

856
00:40:44.700 --> 00:40:46.100
I'm just wondering if you could comment

857
00:40:46.100 --> 00:40:47.690
as the leader of this organization

858
00:40:47.690 --> 00:40:49.570
on what that looks like for your staff

859
00:40:49.570 --> 00:40:52.000
to not only engage in a self care practice

860
00:40:52.000 --> 00:40:53.710
or series of self care practices,

861
00:40:53.710 --> 00:40:55.980
but of community care within

862
00:40:55.980 --> 00:40:58.130
the practice of this organization.

863
00:41:00.080 --> 00:41:01.500
- There's some few...

864
00:41:01.500 --> 00:41:02.250
Thank for the question.

865
00:41:02.250 --> 00:41:03.880
There's a few concrete ways it looks.

866
00:41:03.880 --> 00:41:05.950
We have self care day once a month

867
00:41:05.950 --> 00:41:08.320
where all of our staff
including our interns,

868
00:41:08.320 --> 00:41:10.790
our alumni, academy members

869
00:41:10.790 --> 00:41:12.970
create self care plans for the month.

870
00:41:13.790 --> 00:41:15.090
That's something that we've tried,

871
00:41:15.090 --> 00:41:17.260
one way that we've tried
to operationalize that

872
00:41:17.260 --> 00:41:19.970
but another way is celebration.

873
00:41:19.970 --> 00:41:23.500
Every season, fall and spring,

874
00:41:23.500 --> 00:41:24.970
we have a community showcase

875
00:41:24.970 --> 00:41:27.140
and all of our programs share out

876
00:41:27.140 --> 00:41:28.740
with the music that they've been creating,

877
00:41:28.740 --> 00:41:30.950
they perform the music.

878
00:41:30.950 --> 00:41:32.750
That's a part of our therapeutic model

879
00:41:32.750 --> 00:41:37.750
is the celebration of each
other and of expression.

880
00:41:38.250 --> 00:41:41.090
Because too often, the young
people that we work with,

881
00:41:41.090 --> 00:41:43.050
the adults only come
together in their lives

882
00:41:43.050 --> 00:41:45.120
when something is broken
and something is wrong

883
00:41:45.120 --> 00:41:47.620
and something is bad,
something needs to be fixed.

884
00:41:47.620 --> 00:41:50.730
But they don't come together
to celebrate and honor

885
00:41:50.730 --> 00:41:54.830
resilience, to honor
resistance, to honor achievement

886
00:41:54.830 --> 00:41:58.400
and however small that
achievement and progress is.

887
00:41:58.400 --> 00:42:01.670
And so celebration is an important part of

888
00:42:01.670 --> 00:42:04.740
what self care to me looks like.

889
00:42:04.740 --> 00:42:07.450
Also modeling for the community

890
00:42:07.450 --> 00:42:09.980
what a community of
care looks like, right,

891
00:42:09.980 --> 00:42:14.350
beyond a single organization
or a system of care.

892
00:42:14.350 --> 00:42:17.120
We're not going to eradicate
these health disparities

893
00:42:17.120 --> 00:42:19.660
by throwing money at them.

894
00:42:19.660 --> 00:42:21.330
We have to build, we have to do it

895
00:42:21.330 --> 00:42:22.820
in partnership with community

896
00:42:22.820 --> 00:42:26.730
and what better way to
facilitate community than

897
00:42:26.730 --> 00:42:31.440
through music, through
food (laughs), right?

898
00:42:31.440 --> 00:42:33.770
There's all these things
that are already happening

899
00:42:33.770 --> 00:42:35.100
and if we just pay attention

900
00:42:35.100 --> 00:42:39.090
to how communities are
already exercising self care

901
00:42:40.100 --> 00:42:42.680
and we find ways to integrate
that into our practice

902
00:42:42.680 --> 00:42:44.970
then a lot becomes possible.

903
00:42:47.910 --> 00:42:49.090
- Great, thank you.

904
00:42:49.090 --> 00:42:53.480
(clapping)

905
00:42:54.260 --> 00:42:56.080
So Enroue.

906
00:42:57.800 --> 00:42:59.830
I got a chance to talk to you a little bit

907
00:42:59.830 --> 00:43:01.370
before we were heading,

908
00:43:01.370 --> 00:43:03.970
as we were walking towards
this auditorium today

909
00:43:03.970 --> 00:43:06.360
and one of the things that
I was really struck by

910
00:43:06.360 --> 00:43:09.600
was your commitment to sort
of changing the paradigm

911
00:43:09.600 --> 00:43:13.440
in this work from your
calling from anti-racism

912
00:43:13.440 --> 00:43:16.830
to what you call love and liberation work.

913
00:43:17.980 --> 00:43:22.980
My question for you is
about how you have...

914
00:43:23.060 --> 00:43:26.120
How Smith anti-racism commitment

915
00:43:26.120 --> 00:43:30.100
has informed or impacted your current work

916
00:43:30.100 --> 00:43:33.616
as a social work practitioner
in liberation work?

917
00:43:34.630 --> 00:43:38.250
As you and I are an independent
practitioner, correct?

918
00:43:39.000 --> 00:43:41.240
I have a very small
private practice as well

919
00:43:41.240 --> 00:43:44.210
and I'm personally very
curious to hear about

920
00:43:44.210 --> 00:43:48.150
how you have been able to
hold yourself accountable

921
00:43:48.150 --> 00:43:51.770
in doing this work that's so difficult?

922
00:43:58.320 --> 00:44:00.990
- As everyone has done before

923
00:44:00.990 --> 00:44:02.850
I also really appreciate
just the opportunity

924
00:44:02.850 --> 00:44:06.670
to be here today and to share this,

925
00:44:06.670 --> 00:44:08.800
like to share some of who I am

926
00:44:08.800 --> 00:44:11.670
and how I've come to be here

927
00:44:11.670 --> 00:44:15.460
personally, professionally,
emotionally, spiritually.

928
00:44:17.640 --> 00:44:22.640
I was raised by two
radical revolutionaries.

929
00:44:23.820 --> 00:44:25.480
My mother and my father.

930
00:44:25.480 --> 00:44:28.650
My father born in Boston,

931
00:44:28.650 --> 00:44:32.140
involved in the Black Panther
Party and the communist party.

932
00:44:32.820 --> 00:44:36.160
My mother born in Jamestown, New York,

933
00:44:36.160 --> 00:44:37.600
moved to Boston and became involved

934
00:44:37.600 --> 00:44:39.210
in the communist party.

935
00:44:40.230 --> 00:44:43.500
Labor organizers, revolutionary change,

936
00:44:43.500 --> 00:44:47.440
fundamental systemic change
is what I grew up with.

937
00:44:47.440 --> 00:44:50.030
That was kind of my first, you know?

938
00:44:50.740 --> 00:44:52.630
I was born April 2nd.

939
00:44:53.510 --> 00:44:58.180
Dr. Martin Luther King was
murdered two days later.

940
00:44:58.180 --> 00:45:02.500
I went to my first demonstration and then.

941
00:45:04.460 --> 00:45:09.090
There's always been an analysis of change

942
00:45:09.090 --> 00:45:11.080
that's been really fundamental.

943
00:45:13.170 --> 00:45:16.600
Fast forward to looking
at graduate schools,

944
00:45:16.600 --> 00:45:19.710
looking at this mission
statement that Smith had

945
00:45:19.710 --> 00:45:21.620
and continues to have

946
00:45:22.610 --> 00:45:27.610
was vital as I'm entering into a field

947
00:45:28.380 --> 00:45:31.250
to train and to even within social work

948
00:45:31.250 --> 00:45:33.990
really having this bio psychosocial model

949
00:45:33.990 --> 00:45:35.450
which is much more encompassing

950
00:45:35.450 --> 00:45:37.720
of who we are as human beings.

951
00:45:37.720 --> 00:45:40.440
Coming into this program

952
00:45:41.230 --> 00:45:43.590
with the certain kind
of political analysis.

953
00:45:43.590 --> 00:45:46.870
Also in the mid '90s I became involved

954
00:45:46.870 --> 00:45:49.260
in a spiritual tradition

955
00:45:49.260 --> 00:45:52.040
coming out of the Yoruba people in Nigeria

956
00:45:52.040 --> 00:45:54.960
and then becoming a
priest in that tradition.

957
00:45:54.960 --> 00:45:58.110
As I even applied to schools taking a risk

958
00:45:58.110 --> 00:46:00.070
to say this is all of who I am.

959
00:46:00.070 --> 00:46:03.120
I was a psychology
major, was an undergrad,

960
00:46:03.120 --> 00:46:07.550
been an artist, activist and
a priest in this tradition.

961
00:46:07.550 --> 00:46:09.260
I said if I'm gonna do this work,

962
00:46:09.260 --> 00:46:14.260
if the work of fundamental
change and liberation,

963
00:46:14.290 --> 00:46:15.490
if I'm gonna have a part in that

964
00:46:15.490 --> 00:46:17.610
then it's also about me being whole.

965
00:46:18.200 --> 00:46:19.560
Let me take a risk to say

966
00:46:19.560 --> 00:46:24.050
can I be that here as I
enter into this field?

967
00:46:24.770 --> 00:46:27.150
The good news is it is yes

968
00:46:27.150 --> 00:46:30.530
which is part of the reason
why I'm sitting here today.

969
00:46:33.010 --> 00:46:35.450
On one hand this statement

970
00:46:35.450 --> 00:46:37.170
and the kind of work beforehand,

971
00:46:37.170 --> 00:46:38.520
a lot of it gets framed in terms of

972
00:46:38.520 --> 00:46:41.020
this is the fight that we're doing.

973
00:46:41.020 --> 00:46:43.460
We can't rest until the fight is over

974
00:46:43.460 --> 00:46:46.500
in all kind of various songs and language.

975
00:46:46.500 --> 00:46:48.930
While that is important I also found

976
00:46:48.930 --> 00:46:52.850
even within these
revolutionary communities

977
00:46:54.300 --> 00:46:55.700
what are you building

978
00:46:55.700 --> 00:46:57.170
and the importance of you what you build

979
00:46:57.170 --> 00:46:58.640
and what you're growing.

980
00:46:58.640 --> 00:47:00.770
I actually use an
analogy with a lot of my,

981
00:47:00.770 --> 00:47:02.320
the people who I work with.

982
00:47:04.480 --> 00:47:07.050
You're not gonna get what
you want simply by weeding,

983
00:47:07.050 --> 00:47:09.230
perpetual weeding of a garden.

984
00:47:10.570 --> 00:47:14.850
That's important but
you need to be planting

985
00:47:14.850 --> 00:47:16.670
what you want to grow.

986
00:47:18.420 --> 00:47:22.700
My kind of work, this
kind of liberation work

987
00:47:23.830 --> 00:47:28.830
is as much about myself and my healing

988
00:47:28.970 --> 00:47:31.020
and how do I put myself out there.

989
00:47:32.240 --> 00:47:33.570
Not just kind of in this abstract way

990
00:47:33.570 --> 00:47:36.140
but also some real concrete
skills that I've learned

991
00:47:36.140 --> 00:47:40.410
and had the fortune of
being in certain communities

992
00:47:40.410 --> 00:47:42.940
and a certain level of understanding.

993
00:47:42.940 --> 00:47:45.410
But how do I really bring all that to bear

994
00:47:45.410 --> 00:47:48.620
as I sit on one hand part
of the work that I do

995
00:47:48.620 --> 00:47:50.720
as I sit in the room with somebody

996
00:47:50.720 --> 00:47:53.630
and really look at what are the obstacles

997
00:47:53.630 --> 00:47:55.690
to this person living in the world

998
00:47:55.690 --> 00:47:58.160
in the way that they really want to be.

999
00:47:58.160 --> 00:48:00.190
Even in a way that they may not know

1000
00:48:00.190 --> 00:48:01.400
but what is their potential?

1001
00:48:01.400 --> 00:48:04.070
How do they help manifest that potential?

1002
00:48:04.070 --> 00:48:07.540
What I love now in what I hear here

1003
00:48:07.540 --> 00:48:08.440
but it's also, I mean part of that

1004
00:48:08.440 --> 00:48:09.810
is these are wonderful people

1005
00:48:09.810 --> 00:48:11.940
and I know it doesn't
exist in a lot of the realm

1006
00:48:11.940 --> 00:48:13.930
of mental health work is healing.

1007
00:48:14.710 --> 00:48:19.200
What is the range and depth
of really what healing is

1008
00:48:19.920 --> 00:48:24.020
around social justice
issues, mental health issues,

1009
00:48:24.020 --> 00:48:27.330
emotional issues, physical
issues, spiritual issues?

1010
00:48:27.330 --> 00:48:29.190
What are the things that are in our way

1011
00:48:29.190 --> 00:48:31.060
that prevent us from
the being the world away

1012
00:48:31.060 --> 00:48:33.870
that we want to be or even can envision.

1013
00:48:33.870 --> 00:48:36.440
That then leads to this concept

1014
00:48:36.440 --> 00:48:38.370
and this notion of liberation.

1015
00:48:38.370 --> 00:48:41.640
For me as a male growing
up in this culture

1016
00:48:41.640 --> 00:48:46.360
really being connected to
my heart is not really,

1017
00:48:47.380 --> 00:48:50.080
wasn't really taught that
that was really an option.

1018
00:48:50.080 --> 00:48:53.820
And so learning to not
just be connected to that

1019
00:48:53.820 --> 00:48:55.900
but to also speak from that.

1020
00:48:56.790 --> 00:48:57.790
What's interesting one way

1021
00:48:57.790 --> 00:48:59.880
I was part of a leadership
program and people were like,

1022
00:48:59.880 --> 00:49:01.490
"How do we know when you're doing that

1023
00:49:01.490 --> 00:49:02.930
"because I know that's a goal?"

1024
00:49:02.930 --> 00:49:04.400
I was like, "Well, I
don't know how you'll know

1025
00:49:04.400 --> 00:49:05.600
"but I'll know."

1026
00:49:05.600 --> 00:49:06.600
And part of the reason I know is like

1027
00:49:06.600 --> 00:49:09.330
I can feel my heart like
beating really strongly

1028
00:49:09.330 --> 00:49:12.060
and that has I've learned

1029
00:49:12.060 --> 00:49:13.950
which is what I'm feeling now.

1030
00:49:13.950 --> 00:49:16.610
I've learned that that
gives me good information

1031
00:49:16.610 --> 00:49:21.610
that I'm close to something
that's both vital for me

1032
00:49:21.780 --> 00:49:25.920
and is bigger than me.

1033
00:49:25.920 --> 00:49:28.190
And that I can allow what
I'm saying and what I'm doing

1034
00:49:28.190 --> 00:49:30.690
to touch others in a way that's

1035
00:49:30.690 --> 00:49:33.340
as authentic as I can possibly be.

1036
00:49:38.050 --> 00:49:40.590
It's really whatever it is.

1037
00:49:40.590 --> 00:49:44.900
As a parent, as a clinician, as a healer,

1038
00:49:44.900 --> 00:49:49.520
in its broadest sense as a
person walking down the street,

1039
00:49:51.080 --> 00:49:55.460
sitting in a restaurant,
doing day to day things.

1040
00:49:55.460 --> 00:49:58.050
This other piece for an accountability

1041
00:49:58.050 --> 00:50:00.800
comes from that and it forms that because

1042
00:50:01.970 --> 00:50:05.790
I've made a decision to really be here,

1043
00:50:05.790 --> 00:50:07.790
be present and to be alive.

1044
00:50:07.790 --> 00:50:09.500
That actually say well
if I'm gonna be alive

1045
00:50:09.500 --> 00:50:11.190
what does the mean?

1046
00:50:11.190 --> 00:50:12.800
What are the cost and what are the risks?

1047
00:50:12.800 --> 00:50:14.830
The more that I can do that,

1048
00:50:14.830 --> 00:50:17.670
the more that I can move from that place

1049
00:50:17.670 --> 00:50:21.210
with skill that I also
get in other realms,

1050
00:50:21.210 --> 00:50:22.930
I can really bring something else,

1051
00:50:22.930 --> 00:50:25.610
both for myself and for
whoever I'm working with

1052
00:50:25.610 --> 00:50:27.810
to kind of say look, there's...

1053
00:50:27.810 --> 00:50:29.690
We get to be here.

1054
00:50:30.980 --> 00:50:32.680
We really get to be here

1055
00:50:32.680 --> 00:50:36.590
in as full away as we
can possibly imagine.

1056
00:50:36.590 --> 00:50:38.750
And so if I can help that process along

1057
00:50:38.750 --> 00:50:41.520
in whatever way then wonderful.

1058
00:50:41.520 --> 00:50:44.530
I mean for me, I mean
that's really my life.

1059
00:50:44.530 --> 00:50:46.270
I mean you're all here and
that's wonderful, right?

1060
00:50:46.270 --> 00:50:49.490
But you know, this is also my experience.

1061
00:50:49.490 --> 00:50:51.860
So in my experience if
I can really be here,

1062
00:50:51.860 --> 00:50:54.810
whoa, that's phenomenal.

1063
00:50:54.810 --> 00:50:56.410
And then if I can meet other people here

1064
00:50:56.410 --> 00:50:58.140
like whoa, that's even greater

1065
00:50:58.140 --> 00:51:01.280
because it's not just about me.

1066
00:51:01.280 --> 00:51:03.720
It's all these connections,
it's all of who we are

1067
00:51:03.720 --> 00:51:07.250
and the sum being much
greater than, you know,

1068
00:51:07.250 --> 00:51:09.040
much greater than these parts.

1069
00:51:13.960 --> 00:51:18.350
That's what brings me here in this moment.

1070
00:51:20.620 --> 00:51:22.430
It brings me to share some
of these things with you

1071
00:51:22.430 --> 00:51:25.650
so again, I thank you all for
this wonderful opportunity.

1072
00:51:26.740 --> 00:51:31.740
(clapping)

1073
00:51:38.420 --> 00:51:39.800
(laughs)

1074
00:51:40.990 --> 00:51:43.310
- So something, I mean,

1075
00:51:44.060 --> 00:51:46.160
much of what you said resonated for me,

1076
00:51:46.160 --> 00:51:50.650
sort of what came up
in terms of sentences.

1077
00:51:50.650 --> 00:51:53.470
Ubuntu, I am because we are.

1078
00:51:53.470 --> 00:51:56.700
I particularly was wondering if you would

1079
00:51:56.700 --> 00:51:59.990
talk about sort of

1080
00:52:01.870 --> 00:52:05.410
our work with the folks that we work with

1081
00:52:05.410 --> 00:52:10.410
and how that work becomes
one of accountability.

1082
00:52:11.150 --> 00:52:12.420
Not just in terms of some of the

1083
00:52:12.420 --> 00:52:14.790
clear like ethical checks and balances,

1084
00:52:14.790 --> 00:52:17.520
but what is accountability
from a liberation

1085
00:52:17.520 --> 00:52:19.450
and a loving place look like

1086
00:52:19.450 --> 00:52:22.340
particularly when there is friction?

1087
00:52:25.430 --> 00:52:26.910
- Good question.

1088
00:52:33.170 --> 00:52:36.600
I think so much of, right, that friction

1089
00:52:36.600 --> 00:52:39.840
or the difficulties of that friction

1090
00:52:39.840 --> 00:52:42.990
come in our own resistance.

1091
00:52:44.380 --> 00:52:48.890
The more or kind of the more healing,

1092
00:52:48.890 --> 00:52:51.090
our ability to be present that we have

1093
00:52:51.090 --> 00:52:55.660
then what appears to be
friction is an opportunity.

1094
00:52:55.660 --> 00:52:57.790
I mean it's like oh, it's
an opportunity for fire.

1095
00:52:57.790 --> 00:52:59.550
Well, hopefully we need that.

1096
00:53:02.570 --> 00:53:06.660
Even if whoever we're
with in whatever situation

1097
00:53:07.570 --> 00:53:09.430
it's not necessary that we have to kind of

1098
00:53:09.430 --> 00:53:11.480
try to be in the same place as they are

1099
00:53:11.480 --> 00:53:13.210
or they have to be in the
same place that we are

1100
00:53:13.210 --> 00:53:16.080
but the more that we
can inhabit that space

1101
00:53:16.080 --> 00:53:18.902
we provide an opportunity
that didn't exist before.

1102
00:53:19.550 --> 00:53:21.790
I remember working with, I used to work...

1103
00:53:21.790 --> 00:53:23.550
Well I still do some but
I used to work extensively

1104
00:53:23.550 --> 00:53:26.530
in a community mental health clinic

1105
00:53:26.530 --> 00:53:29.330
with youth with problem sexual behavior

1106
00:53:29.330 --> 00:53:32.800
and in group intensive
outpatient settings.

1107
00:53:32.800 --> 00:53:35.270
I used to run a lot of mindfulness groups

1108
00:53:35.270 --> 00:53:37.800
and I remember there was
this one particular client

1109
00:53:37.800 --> 00:53:40.150
who was also my own individual client.

1110
00:53:41.840 --> 00:53:43.740
Talk about dynamics and transference

1111
00:53:43.740 --> 00:53:46.710
and cotransference and
like he had like boop.

1112
00:53:46.710 --> 00:53:47.840
He knew where my button was

1113
00:53:47.840 --> 00:53:49.610
and he was dancing on it.

1114
00:53:49.610 --> 00:53:52.440
I try to be like, "Oh no, I'm
not gonna fall into this."

1115
00:53:53.260 --> 00:53:56.780
He had so much, there was
so much complex trauma

1116
00:53:56.780 --> 00:53:58.490
that he had experience.

1117
00:53:58.490 --> 00:54:00.830
I remember soon...

1118
00:54:00.830 --> 00:54:02.490
I mean, he was on, we
would get in the group

1119
00:54:02.490 --> 00:54:04.060
and it was like vroom, he was like at me,

1120
00:54:04.060 --> 00:54:07.030
it wasn't about a group and
that was really challenging.

1121
00:54:07.030 --> 00:54:09.790
I remember I got very
sick and I had a fever

1122
00:54:09.790 --> 00:54:12.000
and I was really delirious in this fever.

1123
00:54:12.000 --> 00:54:14.110
I was at home, not in a group.

1124
00:54:14.110 --> 00:54:18.780
I can remember being I mean out there

1125
00:54:18.780 --> 00:54:22.210
and this feeling of like fire everywhere.

1126
00:54:22.210 --> 00:54:26.250
I realized that, that when
I kind of came out of it

1127
00:54:26.250 --> 00:54:28.650
I realized that that feeling

1128
00:54:28.650 --> 00:54:31.720
was something that he
experienced as a norm.

1129
00:54:31.720 --> 00:54:36.720
I realized that what I
needed to do was to be water

1130
00:54:38.030 --> 00:54:41.420
and to be with him and just to be water.

1131
00:54:42.630 --> 00:54:45.000
I could remember after I was,

1132
00:54:45.000 --> 00:54:46.940
when I was sick and I came back to work,

1133
00:54:46.940 --> 00:54:48.840
this group is going on

1134
00:54:48.840 --> 00:54:51.750
and he was doing the same thing.

1135
00:54:51.750 --> 00:54:54.110
Really, directly attacking,
all those other stuff,

1136
00:54:54.110 --> 00:54:56.330
not following the rules, whatever.

1137
00:54:57.920 --> 00:55:01.210
Something had shifted in
me and I could be there

1138
00:55:01.210 --> 00:55:04.760
and be present with him
and not get triggered

1139
00:55:04.760 --> 00:55:07.660
and not be reactive and
he was doing his best,

1140
00:55:07.660 --> 00:55:09.080
and it was this.

1141
00:55:10.090 --> 00:55:11.030
There was nothing there.

1142
00:55:11.030 --> 00:55:15.800
There was nothing for him to push against.

1143
00:55:15.800 --> 00:55:19.990
In that moment he's. (blows)

1144
00:55:22.440 --> 00:55:24.100
There wasn't even (mumbles)
like, "Oh yeah, I did it."

1145
00:55:24.100 --> 00:55:24.940
It was just like wow.

1146
00:55:24.940 --> 00:55:26.570
I was in a very different place.

1147
00:55:26.570 --> 00:55:31.300
The more that and to me that's freedom.

1148
00:55:32.770 --> 00:55:33.890
That was great for me

1149
00:55:33.890 --> 00:55:36.580
and then what I was able
to create in that space

1150
00:55:36.580 --> 00:55:41.210
was radically different than
what I could conceive of.

1151
00:55:45.630 --> 00:55:46.820
Yeah.

1152
00:55:48.770 --> 00:55:53.510
(clapping)

1153
00:55:53.510 --> 00:55:56.070
- We have a little bit of a time so yeah.

1154
00:55:56.070 --> 00:55:57.340
If you.

1155
00:55:57.340 --> 00:55:58.100
- Yeah.

1156
00:55:58.100 --> 00:56:00.030
That's such a great story.

1157
00:56:02.170 --> 00:56:06.820
Both of your sharing out

1158
00:56:06.820 --> 00:56:10.120
and your followup question
just took me back to

1159
00:56:10.120 --> 00:56:13.660
this notion of developing a practice

1160
00:56:13.660 --> 00:56:15.590
and how do we develop a practice

1161
00:56:15.590 --> 00:56:17.560
around our own process and our own growing

1162
00:56:17.560 --> 00:56:18.560
and our own development,

1163
00:56:18.560 --> 00:56:21.280
our own ability to be a healer

1164
00:56:22.200 --> 00:56:24.020
in the work that we do.

1165
00:56:24.840 --> 00:56:27.870
I'm not saying clinician,
I'm saying a healer.

1166
00:56:29.340 --> 00:56:33.910
How you said earlier that
weeding is not enough.

1167
00:56:33.910 --> 00:56:37.780
You come to Smith and you become aware

1168
00:56:37.780 --> 00:56:40.650
of certain things and you go, "I'm a weed.

1169
00:56:40.650 --> 00:56:41.880
"I'm gonna pull those things out."

1170
00:56:41.880 --> 00:56:45.790
But then like you said you
got to be planting seeds

1171
00:56:45.790 --> 00:56:49.490
and you also have to be
watering those seeds.

1172
00:56:49.490 --> 00:56:52.230
You have to be developing a practice

1173
00:56:52.230 --> 00:56:55.350
around fostering and cultivating

1174
00:56:56.300 --> 00:56:58.090
that within you

1175
00:56:58.980 --> 00:57:02.510
that extends beyond your identity

1176
00:57:02.510 --> 00:57:04.240
and work as a clinician.

1177
00:57:04.240 --> 00:57:06.910
But that ultimately allows you

1178
00:57:06.910 --> 00:57:08.860
to be a more effective healer.

1179
00:57:09.610 --> 00:57:12.630
I just want to thank you and
I just want to say that too

1180
00:57:12.630 --> 00:57:14.420
and ask for you to speak on

1181
00:57:14.420 --> 00:57:18.890
how have you developed
a practice in your life?

1182
00:57:18.890 --> 00:57:21.050
Because you're doing this bold work.

1183
00:57:21.050 --> 00:57:25.741
What practice is required to do that work?

1184
00:57:29.730 --> 00:57:31.960
- What's interesting, this
one part of me is drawn

1185
00:57:31.960 --> 00:57:33.770
to kind of like hit a list of things like

1186
00:57:33.770 --> 00:57:35.410
well I do this,
practically I've done this.

1187
00:57:37.270 --> 00:57:38.580
I guess I'll do a little bit of that

1188
00:57:38.580 --> 00:57:42.100
but that's not the main piece.

1189
00:57:43.650 --> 00:57:46.000
I've had a meditation practice for years.

1190
00:57:46.580 --> 00:57:48.590
Well, the biggest thing was

1191
00:57:48.590 --> 00:57:52.380
having some moments in my life

1192
00:57:52.380 --> 00:57:56.110
where it really was about
what is my life about?

1193
00:57:56.630 --> 00:57:58.887
How do I want to exist?

1194
00:57:59.870 --> 00:58:03.120
That actually was a thread
long before I thought about

1195
00:58:03.770 --> 00:58:05.140
being a healer, being a therapist.

1196
00:58:05.140 --> 00:58:08.770
It was much more fundamental
about functioning.

1197
00:58:08.770 --> 00:58:11.130
But that kind of commitment.

1198
00:58:11.130 --> 00:58:12.440
If I'm gonna be here, great.

1199
00:58:12.440 --> 00:58:14.250
So what is this really about?

1200
00:58:14.250 --> 00:58:15.750
And then that being a thread

1201
00:58:15.750 --> 00:58:19.730
in which kind of doing certain
tasks or things in my life.

1202
00:58:22.920 --> 00:58:26.260
Having things that informed me

1203
00:58:26.260 --> 00:58:29.880
about what is health,

1204
00:58:31.230 --> 00:58:32.800
what is wholeness.

1205
00:58:32.800 --> 00:58:35.530
What does it mean to
actually be a human being?

1206
00:58:35.530 --> 00:58:38.970
With that, to bring up just

1207
00:58:38.970 --> 00:58:41.840
the mentioning of the world love, right?

1208
00:58:41.840 --> 00:58:44.010
For me, both healing
and liberation are not

1209
00:58:44.010 --> 00:58:45.930
these kind of like fuzzy new agey like

1210
00:58:45.930 --> 00:58:49.560
you know, rainbows and
unicorns which are good.

1211
00:58:51.180 --> 00:58:54.530
But a real commitment to

1212
00:58:56.120 --> 00:59:00.850
how can I both undo the
messages that I've gotten

1213
00:59:00.850 --> 00:59:02.730
that I'm not enough

1214
00:59:02.730 --> 00:59:07.730
and grow that even the
mystery of what it means,

1215
00:59:08.130 --> 00:59:11.600
to not even relate to it in
terms of what's enough or not.

1216
00:59:11.600 --> 00:59:13.770
But just like, whoa, what is this?

1217
00:59:13.770 --> 00:59:15.130
Here's something in the way.

1218
00:59:15.130 --> 00:59:17.010
All right, let me look at that.

1219
00:59:17.010 --> 00:59:18.010
What does that free up?

1220
00:59:18.010 --> 00:59:20.850
Now I can build and see what
other options there are.

1221
00:59:20.850 --> 00:59:22.780
Yes, there's a weeding process

1222
00:59:22.780 --> 00:59:24.080
but it's like from growing stuff

1223
00:59:24.080 --> 00:59:25.680
now the weed is choking this other thing.

1224
00:59:25.680 --> 00:59:27.990
Clear this away, oh I
have some space here.

1225
00:59:27.990 --> 00:59:30.490
Whoa, what would be great there?

1226
00:59:30.490 --> 00:59:35.340
That's about what my own

1227
00:59:37.630 --> 00:59:39.400
goals, visions, desires.

1228
00:59:39.400 --> 00:59:42.670
But not even just here but
where also it comes from.

1229
00:59:42.670 --> 00:59:45.970
We all have a physical, mental,

1230
00:59:45.970 --> 00:59:48.070
emotional, spiritual affinities for things

1231
00:59:48.070 --> 00:59:50.270
also based on where we come from.

1232
00:59:50.270 --> 00:59:51.540
If you look at your
ancestor you can see like

1233
00:59:51.540 --> 00:59:52.560
oh yeah, there were these people

1234
00:59:52.560 --> 00:59:54.310
who were interested in some weird things

1235
00:59:54.310 --> 00:59:55.850
and some of it might be...

1236
00:59:55.850 --> 00:59:57.140
You know, I used to do
a lot of woodworking

1237
00:59:57.140 --> 01:00:01.620
so having the ability

1238
01:00:01.620 --> 01:00:04.560
to feel things,

1239
01:00:04.560 --> 01:00:07.090
my hands be physically
sensitive for certain things,

1240
01:00:07.090 --> 01:00:08.630
certain strength in fingers.

1241
01:00:08.630 --> 01:00:10.260
That allows me to be connected

1242
01:00:10.260 --> 01:00:14.370
with certain types of work
and carving and creativity.

1243
01:00:14.370 --> 01:00:15.370
Paying attention to those.

1244
01:00:15.370 --> 01:00:18.240
What am I drawn towards?

1245
01:00:18.240 --> 01:00:19.970
It's like plants grow towards light

1246
01:00:19.970 --> 01:00:23.960
so what am I naturally
then being pulled towards

1247
01:00:23.960 --> 01:00:28.380
as a natural process and as
this is what I'm trying to do.

1248
01:00:28.380 --> 01:00:30.120
This is what I'm trying
to be connected with,

1249
01:00:30.120 --> 01:00:31.880
myself and other people.

1250
01:00:31.880 --> 01:00:36.880
How do I then also offset
the kind of isolation,

1251
01:00:36.950 --> 01:00:41.260
isolationist notion and
model of this culture?

1252
01:00:41.260 --> 01:00:43.130
I'm doing it on my own,
I've got my practice,

1253
01:00:43.130 --> 01:00:45.060
I've got all the answer,
I'm gonna build this thing

1254
01:00:45.060 --> 01:00:48.270
to like oh, I know community is important.

1255
01:00:48.270 --> 01:00:49.870
How do I create collectives?

1256
01:00:51.150 --> 01:00:54.030
That means I have to like
what to compromise or not.

1257
01:00:54.030 --> 01:00:56.670
These people have the skill
for this kind of vision, right?

1258
01:00:56.670 --> 01:00:58.710
But that's like a place
I can stretch and grow

1259
01:00:58.710 --> 01:01:02.510
because I know, a, I know that
I don't have all the answers

1260
01:01:02.510 --> 01:01:06.130
and that a lot of traditions
that I found value in.

1261
01:01:08.940 --> 01:01:10.360
People have come before us

1262
01:01:10.360 --> 01:01:12.870
and have figured out a lot of things.

1263
01:01:13.660 --> 01:01:15.730
We get into like what is evidence-based?

1264
01:01:15.730 --> 01:01:16.990
Whose evidence and how long

1265
01:01:16.990 --> 01:01:19.280
has that actually been
around is a good question.

1266
01:01:21.000 --> 01:01:23.190
How do I stretch to say that you know,

1267
01:01:23.190 --> 01:01:25.950
people working together, community

1268
01:01:26.880 --> 01:01:30.180
teaching leaders, healing
healers, all of these things

1269
01:01:30.180 --> 01:01:34.060
which is also part of my
kind of work practice.

1270
01:01:35.080 --> 01:01:37.880
How do I stretch to do that as well

1271
01:01:37.880 --> 01:01:39.520
even when it's uncomfortable

1272
01:01:39.520 --> 01:01:40.750
and well, it's really easier.

1273
01:01:40.750 --> 01:01:41.720
I know I'm smart enough.

1274
01:01:41.720 --> 01:01:43.920
I can just figure out how
to do all these things.

1275
01:01:43.920 --> 01:01:45.870
Yeah, I can figure out all the billing.

1276
01:01:45.870 --> 01:01:48.830
You mean I could hire somebody to do that

1277
01:01:48.830 --> 01:01:50.630
and that would free me up to do this

1278
01:01:50.630 --> 01:01:52.110
and they could do that.

1279
01:01:53.320 --> 01:01:55.030
Some people say like, "Well,
of course you do that."

1280
01:01:55.030 --> 01:01:56.940
But some of these
individual model is like,

1281
01:01:56.940 --> 01:01:58.130
"Well no, I have to do that, too.

1282
01:01:58.130 --> 01:01:58.960
"Let me figure that out

1283
01:01:58.960 --> 01:02:00.340
"and let me like create the templates

1284
01:02:00.340 --> 01:02:01.770
"for all these documents and assessments,"

1285
01:02:01.770 --> 01:02:02.840
and blah, blah, blah that I'm doing

1286
01:02:02.840 --> 01:02:04.880
that are actually related
to something I care about

1287
01:02:04.880 --> 01:02:08.410
versus just here's the checklist of things

1288
01:02:08.410 --> 01:02:10.700
and demographics that need to be done.

1289
01:02:12.960 --> 01:02:16.290
I think I connected to something
you were talking about.

1290
01:02:16.290 --> 01:02:18.630
(laughs)

1291
01:02:18.630 --> 01:02:20.020
I'll stop there, thank you.

1292
01:02:20.020 --> 01:02:20.980
- [Kenta] Thank you.

1293
01:02:20.980 --> 01:02:25.980
(clapping)

1294
01:02:27.800 --> 01:02:29.300
Wow, we've got like what,

1295
01:02:29.300 --> 01:02:32.670
25 minutes for questions and answers.

1296
01:02:32.670 --> 01:02:34.310
That's pretty impressive.

1297
01:02:34.310 --> 01:02:36.640
Thank you so much for
working with me on this.

1298
01:02:36.640 --> 01:02:38.500
(clapping)

1299
01:02:38.500 --> 01:02:41.200
Thank you Isaiah for
keeping us on schedule.

1300
01:02:42.040 --> 01:02:46.200
Okay, so does anybody have questions?

1301
01:02:47.050 --> 01:02:48.150
Yes.

1302
01:02:48.150 --> 01:02:50.340
I think the microphone is gonna be.

1303
01:02:55.090 --> 01:02:56.830
- [Woman in black] Thank you so much.

1304
01:02:56.830 --> 01:02:58.460
I'm a second summer master student

1305
01:02:58.460 --> 01:03:00.870
and the more time I spend at Smith,

1306
01:03:00.870 --> 01:03:03.430
the more I've come to appreciate how

1307
01:03:03.430 --> 01:03:05.740
Smith actually lives
the anti-racism mission

1308
01:03:05.740 --> 01:03:06.740
in events like tonight,

1309
01:03:06.740 --> 01:03:09.410
and your panel has been so rich.

1310
01:03:09.410 --> 01:03:12.640
A question I have for any of you

1311
01:03:12.640 --> 01:03:14.970
and Enroue, you touched on
this in your description

1312
01:03:14.970 --> 01:03:18.470
of the client that was really
difficult to work with.

1313
01:03:19.880 --> 01:03:21.650
I guess one of the things
that Smith is known for

1314
01:03:21.650 --> 01:03:23.590
in addition to its anti-racism mission

1315
01:03:23.590 --> 01:03:27.890
is its commitment to a
psychodynamic theoretical tradition

1316
01:03:27.890 --> 01:03:30.230
and I'm wondering how
you've incorporated that

1317
01:03:30.230 --> 01:03:32.850
in your clinical or community work

1318
01:03:33.710 --> 01:03:36.680
in conjunction with your anti-racism work?

1319
01:03:41.840 --> 01:03:43.290
- I'll prefer this way.

1320
01:03:43.940 --> 01:03:45.240
- (mumbles)

1321
01:03:45.240 --> 01:03:46.410
- You got it, you got it.

1322
01:03:46.410 --> 01:03:49.150
(laughs)

1323
01:03:49.150 --> 01:03:50.150
I'll piggyback.

1324
01:03:50.150 --> 01:03:51.120
- Then I'll add, I'll add.

1325
01:03:51.120 --> 01:03:52.770
But I'll add.
- [Keshia] Okay.

1326
01:03:56.220 --> 01:03:59.270
For me it comes back to sort
of this idea of translation.

1327
01:04:00.260 --> 01:04:01.920
That's something that's resonant for me

1328
01:04:01.920 --> 01:04:05.160
in terms of linguistics and language.

1329
01:04:05.160 --> 01:04:08.050
For me particularly useful

1330
01:04:09.070 --> 01:04:13.200
in bridging and integrating
some of these perspective

1331
01:04:13.200 --> 01:04:15.840
inclusive of psychodynamic perspective

1332
01:04:15.840 --> 01:04:18.740
is being able to also locate

1333
01:04:18.740 --> 01:04:20.810
sort of the theoretical
understandings, right?

1334
01:04:20.810 --> 01:04:23.010
I think that's really important.

1335
01:04:23.010 --> 01:04:27.120
For me even in my sort of
my direct practice work

1336
01:04:27.120 --> 01:04:29.750
as well as in my teaching practice,

1337
01:04:29.750 --> 01:04:33.320
using for example Kohutian self-psychology

1338
01:04:33.320 --> 01:04:34.960
and expanding the narrative around,

1339
01:04:34.960 --> 01:04:37.300
for example, the need for
twinship or mirroring.

1340
01:04:37.300 --> 01:04:39.400
And how if we're talking about for example

1341
01:04:39.400 --> 01:04:40.970
something like the self object

1342
01:04:40.970 --> 01:04:43.740
and the need for sort of
this idealizing object,

1343
01:04:43.740 --> 01:04:46.170
that that then can be translated into

1344
01:04:46.170 --> 01:04:48.770
what does it mean to be living
in systems of domination

1345
01:04:48.770 --> 01:04:51.440
that impact our self object or self,

1346
01:04:51.440 --> 01:04:54.310
ideas of self and even sort of ,

1347
01:04:54.310 --> 01:04:56.410
you know, living in an
individualistic society

1348
01:04:56.410 --> 01:04:57.650
that says that we have to be ourselves

1349
01:04:57.650 --> 01:05:00.500
versus sort of a collection of selves.

1350
01:05:01.480 --> 01:05:05.960
That becomes an overlay that
for me is a way to again

1351
01:05:05.960 --> 01:05:07.160
enter into a conversation

1352
01:05:07.160 --> 01:05:09.330
with folks who speak that language.

1353
01:05:09.330 --> 01:05:13.500
To be able to embrace then
the impact of not only

1354
01:05:13.500 --> 01:05:15.500
the experience of marginalization within

1355
01:05:15.500 --> 01:05:17.500
systems of domination and oppression,

1356
01:05:17.500 --> 01:05:20.030
but also then how one internalizes

1357
01:05:20.030 --> 01:05:21.800
and therefore relates to that,

1358
01:05:21.800 --> 01:05:22.970
and so why it's important.

1359
01:05:22.970 --> 01:05:25.380
For example I talked about the fact that

1360
01:05:25.380 --> 01:05:27.750
even though I came with a certain level

1361
01:05:27.750 --> 01:05:30.010
of consciousness and politicization,

1362
01:05:30.010 --> 01:05:32.850
that it was really
important for myself object

1363
01:05:32.850 --> 01:05:35.790
that when I came to a school
it had an anti-racism mission

1364
01:05:35.790 --> 01:05:38.190
and had a Black woman who was a dean.

1365
01:05:38.190 --> 01:05:39.390
And that that mirroring object

1366
01:05:39.390 --> 01:05:42.990
and that experience of
twinship allowed me to imagine

1367
01:05:42.990 --> 01:05:45.400
something that wasn't within
my direct understanding

1368
01:05:45.400 --> 01:05:48.670
of the ways in which the
constructs I was living in

1369
01:05:48.670 --> 01:05:51.600
were dictating who I should be.

1370
01:05:51.600 --> 01:05:55.410
For me, understanding
that particular frame

1371
01:05:55.410 --> 01:05:57.140
and again, you know, talk to me later

1372
01:05:57.140 --> 01:05:59.140
and I've got lots of criticisms as well

1373
01:05:59.140 --> 01:06:02.180
and not just me about it.

1374
01:06:02.180 --> 01:06:04.250
But that there are
conceptual ways in which

1375
01:06:04.250 --> 01:06:06.220
I think as we talk about communities

1376
01:06:06.220 --> 01:06:07.940
and even this comment that Enroue made

1377
01:06:07.940 --> 01:06:09.920
about sort of this idea of whose evidence,

1378
01:06:09.920 --> 01:06:12.890
that these ideas have been planted before.

1379
01:06:13.280 --> 01:06:16.230
Then the ideas don't
have to take the same,

1380
01:06:16.230 --> 01:06:18.800
the friction gets taken
out of it for me around it

1381
01:06:18.800 --> 01:06:21.830
and necessitating being one in

1382
01:06:21.830 --> 01:06:24.260
which I'm wedded to
psychodynamic perspectives.

1383
01:06:24.260 --> 01:06:26.370
But if that's gonna be
the helpful framework

1384
01:06:26.370 --> 01:06:29.570
for me to be able to have
a liberatory conversation

1385
01:06:29.570 --> 01:06:32.310
then I feel it is important that I be able

1386
01:06:32.310 --> 01:06:33.740
to be versed in that language,

1387
01:06:33.740 --> 01:06:36.070
to be able to have fluent conversation.

1388
01:06:36.070 --> 01:06:37.280
If that's what's gonna be useful,

1389
01:06:37.280 --> 01:06:39.150
like for some of the
folks that I work with,

1390
01:06:39.150 --> 01:06:40.640
that's not a particularly useful way

1391
01:06:40.640 --> 01:06:43.050
of understanding their experience

1392
01:06:43.050 --> 01:06:44.890
and for some folks it is.

1393
01:06:44.890 --> 01:06:48.080
I want to make sure that I
have the breadth of tools

1394
01:06:48.080 --> 01:06:49.930
such that if that is a useful way

1395
01:06:49.930 --> 01:06:52.400
for somebody to get to an understanding

1396
01:06:52.400 --> 01:06:54.270
about who they are in the world

1397
01:06:54.270 --> 01:06:56.160
and who they want to be and why

1398
01:06:56.160 --> 01:06:57.870
there may be dissonance around that,

1399
01:06:57.870 --> 01:07:01.070
then you know, I feel it
incumbent upon to be able to

1400
01:07:01.070 --> 01:07:03.790
have some way of understanding that.

1401
01:07:07.390 --> 01:07:11.480
- I mean I'd like to
echo the sentiment around

1402
01:07:11.480 --> 01:07:15.740
just appreciating the,
you know, what learning,

1403
01:07:16.720 --> 01:07:19.360
kind of the psychodynamic
orientation has helped

1404
01:07:19.360 --> 01:07:22.280
and the role that its
played in understanding

1405
01:07:23.520 --> 01:07:26.460
processes that I've
witnessed in individuals,

1406
01:07:26.460 --> 01:07:30.770
and be surfaced in the community

1407
01:07:30.770 --> 01:07:32.870
and reenacted over and over
again in the community.

1408
01:07:32.870 --> 01:07:35.610
And just being able to look at it,

1409
01:07:35.610 --> 01:07:39.980
go below the surface in having

1410
01:07:39.980 --> 01:07:42.110
theories and frameworks

1411
01:07:42.110 --> 01:07:46.530
to guide the processing of that.

1412
01:07:47.450 --> 01:07:49.690
But I will say I chose to come to Smith

1413
01:07:49.690 --> 01:07:53.720
because I had a mentor in my
life that was a Smith alum.

1414
01:07:53.720 --> 01:07:56.690
To me, go back to that twinship,

1415
01:07:56.690 --> 01:07:59.000
he's an African American
male social worker.

1416
01:07:59.000 --> 01:08:02.300
He actually came back to
get his PhD here at Smith

1417
01:08:02.300 --> 01:08:04.040
and I saw him as Yoda

1418
01:08:04.040 --> 01:08:06.660
and I wanted to be like Yoda.

1419
01:08:06.660 --> 01:08:09.570
Not because he had magical powers

1420
01:08:09.570 --> 01:08:11.310
but he had this ability.

1421
01:08:11.310 --> 01:08:15.550
He had access to frameworks and concepts

1422
01:08:15.550 --> 01:08:19.280
that allowed him to look deeply

1423
01:08:19.280 --> 01:08:22.350
inside of the young people
that he was working with,

1424
01:08:22.350 --> 01:08:24.970
and be able to make sense of that.

1425
01:08:25.600 --> 01:08:29.040
I also want to say that
my experience at Smith,

1426
01:08:29.040 --> 01:08:31.200
it's not the end all, be all.

1427
01:08:31.200 --> 01:08:34.470
That we still have,
there's a lot of learning

1428
01:08:34.470 --> 01:08:37.670
and my first master's was here at Smith.

1429
01:08:37.670 --> 01:08:40.440
I would say my second
came from the young people

1430
01:08:40.440 --> 01:08:42.310
in starting the CBO.

1431
01:08:42.310 --> 01:08:44.000
What I've learned from my community

1432
01:08:44.000 --> 01:08:46.040
and from young people in my community

1433
01:08:46.040 --> 01:08:50.510
and how I've leveraged my
learning here to enhance

1434
01:08:50.510 --> 01:08:52.920
the learning out in the community.

1435
01:08:53.640 --> 01:08:56.050
I think that it's a great starting point.

1436
01:08:56.050 --> 01:08:57.990
It gives you a great foundation

1437
01:08:57.990 --> 01:09:00.220
and it continues to inform my practice,

1438
01:09:00.220 --> 01:09:02.830
but there are other things that continue

1439
01:09:02.830 --> 01:09:04.810
to inform my practice as well.

1440
01:09:09.500 --> 01:09:11.250
- I'll now chime in.

1441
01:09:12.470 --> 01:09:14.340
Actually in the beginning I had some

1442
01:09:14.340 --> 01:09:15.470
kind of resistance about this.

1443
01:09:15.470 --> 01:09:19.480
Some of it is that my...

1444
01:09:19.480 --> 01:09:20.910
When I think about kind of my framework

1445
01:09:20.910 --> 01:09:24.450
it's not now in a
particularly psychodynamic

1446
01:09:24.450 --> 01:09:26.210
theory-oriented framework.

1447
01:09:26.210 --> 01:09:29.720
Though after hearing, really
hearing my colleagues,

1448
01:09:29.720 --> 01:09:32.790
understanding that it has
been a very useful tool to me

1449
01:09:32.790 --> 01:09:34.700
which is actually why I came here.

1450
01:09:37.560 --> 01:09:39.500
I was initiated and started seeing people,

1451
01:09:39.500 --> 01:09:42.530
kind of spiritual work
in the Orisha tradition.

1452
01:09:42.530 --> 01:09:44.860
Both people in that
tradition and outside of it

1453
01:09:44.860 --> 01:09:47.000
and one of the reasons
I wanted to come here

1454
01:09:47.000 --> 01:09:49.610
was so that I can really work with people

1455
01:09:49.610 --> 01:09:52.230
in a much broader realm

1456
01:09:52.230 --> 01:09:53.830
and broader range of issues,

1457
01:09:53.830 --> 01:09:57.380
than solely specifically
in people within this,

1458
01:09:57.380 --> 01:10:01.260
this or other African-based or
indigenous-based traditions.

1459
01:10:02.600 --> 01:10:06.410
Currently so an example
is I have a client now.

1460
01:10:07.890 --> 01:10:09.290
Some complex trauma,

1461
01:10:09.290 --> 01:10:11.660
some early abuse that she's experienced,

1462
01:10:11.660 --> 01:10:15.470
a lot of anxiety and we started sessions

1463
01:10:15.470 --> 01:10:17.270
kind of more traditionally in the room.

1464
01:10:17.270 --> 01:10:20.460
She's in front of me looking at,

1465
01:10:20.460 --> 01:10:22.040
also being really trauma informed

1466
01:10:22.040 --> 01:10:24.100
which I actually got mostly out of my,

1467
01:10:24.100 --> 01:10:26.740
both my first year as placement,

1468
01:10:26.740 --> 01:10:28.410
and then where I ended up working,

1469
01:10:28.410 --> 01:10:30.900
a community-based health
center in New Haven.

1470
01:10:32.320 --> 01:10:37.320
She was also involved in native ceremonies

1471
01:10:37.560 --> 01:10:41.360
and specifically like Santo Daime

1472
01:10:41.360 --> 01:10:44.820
or traditional sacred
medicines from South America,

1473
01:10:44.820 --> 01:10:47.030
Ayahuasca being among one of them.

1474
01:10:47.030 --> 01:10:48.470
And was telling me about some ceremonies

1475
01:10:48.470 --> 01:10:50.230
that she had participated in.

1476
01:10:50.230 --> 01:10:51.470
In of them she was talking about

1477
01:10:51.470 --> 01:10:53.570
very strong experiences she had

1478
01:10:53.570 --> 01:10:56.040
when these Orisha songs were being sung.

1479
01:10:56.040 --> 01:10:57.810
The Orisha, the name of the divinities

1480
01:10:57.810 --> 01:11:00.130
from the Yoruba tradition.

1481
01:11:01.150 --> 01:11:03.650
She didn't know or had forgotten

1482
01:11:03.650 --> 01:11:05.050
that I was a priest in that tradition

1483
01:11:05.050 --> 01:11:06.520
and so when she brought
that up I then said,

1484
01:11:06.520 --> 01:11:08.890
"Oh well, you know, if you're interested

1485
01:11:08.890 --> 01:11:10.970
"I can talk to you more
about these things."

1486
01:11:11.960 --> 01:11:14.240
Fast forward to now,

1487
01:11:14.240 --> 01:11:17.860
I think only been seeing
her for about four months.

1488
01:11:17.860 --> 01:11:20.430
We now have our sessions
which are now twice a week

1489
01:11:20.430 --> 01:11:22.190
because of a crisis that she's in,

1490
01:11:22.190 --> 01:11:23.900
she's also pregnant.

1491
01:11:23.900 --> 01:11:27.640
We now conduct our sessions
by this very special river

1492
01:11:27.640 --> 01:11:30.860
at the foot of this
mountain that we go to.

1493
01:11:32.680 --> 01:11:35.550
The work and the healing
that I do with her

1494
01:11:35.550 --> 01:11:38.320
is both very informed about

1495
01:11:38.320 --> 01:11:40.480
where things are coming from

1496
01:11:40.480 --> 01:11:42.150
and how they're manifesting now for her

1497
01:11:42.150 --> 01:11:45.160
very much based on psychodynamic theory

1498
01:11:45.160 --> 01:11:47.770
and being trauma informed.

1499
01:11:48.430 --> 01:11:53.060
As well as connecting with
the spiritual traditions

1500
01:11:53.060 --> 01:11:55.800
and praying with her,

1501
01:11:55.800 --> 01:11:58.670
and helping her to pray
and to voice what she wants

1502
01:11:58.670 --> 01:12:00.240
or what challenges are.

1503
01:12:00.240 --> 01:12:04.070
As well as sometimes
we kind of take a break

1504
01:12:04.070 --> 01:12:05.510
and really there's a
lot of psycho education

1505
01:12:05.510 --> 01:12:06.570
that's being done,

1506
01:12:06.570 --> 01:12:08.880
just so she has a better understanding of

1507
01:12:08.880 --> 01:12:11.670
the range of what's
happening to her and why.

1508
01:12:11.670 --> 01:12:12.780
How things are embodied,

1509
01:12:12.780 --> 01:12:15.220
how having a child is triggering

1510
01:12:15.220 --> 01:12:19.620
kind of pre-verbal memories
of abuse that have come up

1511
01:12:19.620 --> 01:12:21.290
and notions of motherhood and nurturing.

1512
01:12:21.290 --> 01:12:24.010
And then also combining that with

1513
01:12:24.920 --> 01:12:27.730
divinities connected with
mothering and nurturing

1514
01:12:27.730 --> 01:12:30.330
and water and nurturing her
own sense of what that is

1515
01:12:30.330 --> 01:12:34.290
and creating sacred space
for all of that to be there.

1516
01:12:36.890 --> 01:12:39.740
There's a ton out there
for your own growth

1517
01:12:39.740 --> 01:12:43.510
as a healer, as a
clinician, as a human being

1518
01:12:43.510 --> 01:12:46.520
and this is a really wonderful foundation

1519
01:12:46.520 --> 01:12:48.470
to begin that process with.

1520
01:12:50.150 --> 01:12:51.410
- Thank you.

1521
01:12:51.410 --> 01:12:53.690
Does anybody have any other questions?

1522
01:12:53.690 --> 01:12:54.740
Rachel.

1523
01:12:58.330 --> 01:13:01.670
- [Voiceover] This has been,
hello, absolutely mesmerizing

1524
01:13:01.670 --> 01:13:02.730
watching the three of you

1525
01:13:02.730 --> 01:13:05.570
and the work that you
do is really inspiring.

1526
01:13:05.570 --> 01:13:07.100
So thank you so much,

1527
01:13:07.100 --> 01:13:09.110
it's been an incredible panel.

1528
01:13:09.110 --> 01:13:11.580
Something that I have a
very clinical question

1529
01:13:11.580 --> 01:13:13.440
and it's something that I find

1530
01:13:13.440 --> 01:13:15.750
being raised in our classes frequently,

1531
01:13:15.750 --> 01:13:18.120
I'm a second year and
this is the question.

1532
01:13:18.120 --> 01:13:19.320
And I find that you know,

1533
01:13:19.320 --> 01:13:20.780
each person has a different perspective

1534
01:13:20.780 --> 01:13:23.220
but I think personally
as a person of color,

1535
01:13:23.220 --> 01:13:24.680
when you've got systems playing out

1536
01:13:24.680 --> 01:13:27.320
and history coming up when you are sitting

1537
01:13:27.320 --> 01:13:30.900
in a room with a client, use of self

1538
01:13:30.900 --> 01:13:34.030
and (mumbles) when are you directive?

1539
01:13:34.030 --> 01:13:35.700
When do you address the issue of race?

1540
01:13:35.700 --> 01:13:37.270
Do you bring it into the room?

1541
01:13:37.270 --> 01:13:38.850
Is it an automatic?

1542
01:13:39.830 --> 01:13:42.310
When do you address your multiple selves?

1543
01:13:42.310 --> 01:13:45.270
Is it in relation to the clients?

1544
01:13:45.270 --> 01:13:47.510
Is it an automatic decisions that you make

1545
01:13:47.510 --> 01:13:50.350
with everyone that's
consistent in uniform?

1546
01:13:50.350 --> 01:13:52.480
And so I wanted to know how you

1547
01:13:52.480 --> 01:13:53.520
sort of work through that

1548
01:13:53.520 --> 01:13:56.050
and also if it's shifted
through your progression

1549
01:13:56.050 --> 01:13:58.560
as a clinician, as a healer?

1550
01:14:00.450 --> 01:14:01.690
- [Voiceover] Can you
repeat the question, sir?

1551
01:14:01.690 --> 01:14:04.090
- Yeah, did everybody hear the question?

1552
01:14:04.090 --> 01:14:07.770
The question is about the speaker's

1553
01:14:07.770 --> 01:14:12.200
approach to addressing race and racism

1554
01:14:12.200 --> 01:14:14.470
in clinical space,

1555
01:14:14.470 --> 01:14:19.470
and how do they use the self in that room.

1556
01:14:21.080 --> 01:14:23.010
- I remember when I graduated,

1557
01:14:23.010 --> 01:14:25.850
I'm sorry I was jumping in
because I just had this thought.

1558
01:14:25.850 --> 01:14:27.420
I remember when I graduated here

1559
01:14:27.420 --> 01:14:28.550
I knew what I wanted to do

1560
01:14:28.550 --> 01:14:30.960
was work with boys and young men of color.

1561
01:14:33.020 --> 01:14:36.950
People discouraged me from using that term

1562
01:14:36.950 --> 01:14:40.800
and saying that this
is a therapeutic model

1563
01:14:40.800 --> 01:14:45.800
designed in partnership
with boys and men of color,

1564
01:14:45.870 --> 01:14:48.610
and for boys and men of color.

1565
01:14:48.610 --> 01:14:51.540
Me as a man of color and what that means

1566
01:14:51.540 --> 01:14:54.450
and how I use my own lived experience

1567
01:14:54.450 --> 01:14:58.960
and struggles as a young man of color.

1568
01:15:01.040 --> 01:15:04.550
And so for me now it's funny to me

1569
01:15:04.550 --> 01:15:08.990
that we have My Brother's
Keeper and a national initiative

1570
01:15:08.990 --> 01:15:10.630
coming out from President Obama

1571
01:15:10.630 --> 01:15:13.200
naming the fact that we
have this health disparities

1572
01:15:13.200 --> 01:15:17.330
that are super concentrated
amongst boys and men of color.

1573
01:15:17.330 --> 01:15:20.370
And in California we have
Sons and Brothers Initiative

1574
01:15:20.370 --> 01:15:21.950
which is a state-wide initiative.

1575
01:15:21.950 --> 01:15:25.170
It's funny to me how things trend, right?

1576
01:15:25.170 --> 01:15:28.960
And what's appropriate was
appropriate 10 years ago.

1577
01:15:31.720 --> 01:15:35.350
Now things shift all the
time with respect to that

1578
01:15:35.350 --> 01:15:40.350
and so I think that
where I've arrived to now

1579
01:15:40.590 --> 01:15:45.230
is I lean towards the authenticity

1580
01:15:45.230 --> 01:15:49.830
because I work with young
people that can spot a rat.

1581
01:15:49.830 --> 01:15:53.700
That can spot somebody being disgenuine

1582
01:15:53.700 --> 01:15:55.640
and so I'm gonna keep it real.

1583
01:15:56.380 --> 01:15:58.870
I'm gonna keep it real
about why I love this work

1584
01:15:58.870 --> 01:16:00.110
and why I do this work,

1585
01:16:00.110 --> 01:16:02.780
and who I intend to help.

1586
01:16:02.780 --> 01:16:04.580
It's not just boys and men of color.

1587
01:16:04.580 --> 01:16:06.520
My organization's mission has evolved

1588
01:16:06.520 --> 01:16:10.420
to say that we serve boys and men of color

1589
01:16:10.420 --> 01:16:12.620
to marginalized youth because we recognize

1590
01:16:12.620 --> 01:16:14.220
that it's not just boys and men of color

1591
01:16:14.220 --> 01:16:15.940
that are being marginalized.

1592
01:16:16.690 --> 01:16:18.270
And so we want to expand

1593
01:16:18.270 --> 01:16:20.250
upon that mission and that work.

1594
01:16:21.440 --> 01:16:22.550
I'm just riffing.

1595
01:16:23.830 --> 01:16:26.800
I just want to say that
things change, things shift.

1596
01:16:26.800 --> 01:16:29.170
What's acceptable and appropriate,

1597
01:16:29.170 --> 01:16:31.040
widely accepted and appropriate.

1598
01:16:31.040 --> 01:16:34.300
Also I think I err in the
side of being authentic

1599
01:16:34.300 --> 01:16:36.660
but in a way that serves a purpose.

1600
01:16:38.370 --> 01:16:40.130
I know that it's case by case.

1601
01:16:41.400 --> 01:16:42.550
I'd like to pass it to you guys

1602
01:16:42.550 --> 01:16:44.970
and hear your thoughts on it.

1603
01:16:52.000 --> 01:16:53.150
- Okay.

1604
01:16:54.720 --> 01:16:56.220
Authenticity.

1605
01:16:57.500 --> 01:17:02.500
I probably use more self now

1606
01:17:02.640 --> 01:17:04.880
than I did initially.

1607
01:17:04.880 --> 01:17:09.650
it's always in kind of
service of the other person,

1608
01:17:09.650 --> 01:17:14.140
people in the room or in the space.

1609
01:17:14.140 --> 01:17:15.650
It's not like, "Hey,
that reminds me of this,

1610
01:17:15.650 --> 01:17:17.800
"like funny thing, that blah, blah."

1611
01:17:19.060 --> 01:17:21.500
That's really important

1612
01:17:21.500 --> 01:17:25.890
and I find that the more kind
of internal work I'm doing,

1613
01:17:25.890 --> 01:17:28.370
the more I can really be
present and not reactive

1614
01:17:28.370 --> 01:17:30.630
to either get pulled into something

1615
01:17:30.630 --> 01:17:31.840
that I think is happening

1616
01:17:31.840 --> 01:17:34.000
which might just be my assumption.

1617
01:17:34.000 --> 01:17:36.120
To not get pulled into a

1618
01:17:37.210 --> 01:17:38.580
projection that they might have

1619
01:17:38.580 --> 01:17:41.780
because yes, I'm a man of color.

1620
01:17:41.780 --> 01:17:44.270
They can't sometimes quite figure out

1621
01:17:44.270 --> 01:17:46.990
where I might be from or not.

1622
01:17:47.640 --> 01:17:49.920
Or they might be identified white

1623
01:17:49.920 --> 01:17:52.960
and have some really racist things

1624
01:17:52.960 --> 01:17:55.560
that they're doing or saying.

1625
01:17:55.560 --> 01:17:59.300
The more I can really again
meet them where they are,

1626
01:17:59.300 --> 01:18:02.260
check myself the better.

1627
01:18:02.260 --> 01:18:03.820
Just the better in general.

1628
01:18:06.640 --> 01:18:08.310
Also in general not just in terms of race

1629
01:18:08.310 --> 01:18:10.970
but also when appropriate.

1630
01:18:10.970 --> 01:18:13.100
Mostly when I get a sense,

1631
01:18:13.100 --> 01:18:14.870
when I can see someone really feeling

1632
01:18:14.870 --> 01:18:17.680
isolated in their experience,

1633
01:18:17.680 --> 01:18:20.120
that sometimes is a way that I say

1634
01:18:20.120 --> 01:18:22.790
this is awesome in my experience.

1635
01:18:22.790 --> 01:18:24.420
They have an understanding of like,

1636
01:18:24.420 --> 01:18:27.090
oh, yes, there's a human being out there.

1637
01:18:27.090 --> 01:18:30.190
It has this and they look normal, right,

1638
01:18:30.190 --> 01:18:31.160
or whatever that is.

1639
01:18:31.160 --> 01:18:32.730
Or wow, this person
who's kind of helping me

1640
01:18:32.730 --> 01:18:36.050
and I can actually share something that

1641
01:18:36.050 --> 01:18:38.150
I feel like no one else gets

1642
01:18:38.940 --> 01:18:40.670
and they get it a little bit.

1643
01:18:40.670 --> 01:18:43.740
Doesn't always require some disclosure.

1644
01:18:43.740 --> 01:18:46.240
And again, that comes kind of over time

1645
01:18:46.240 --> 01:18:48.040
just because I feel like
oh, they're feeling alone,

1646
01:18:48.040 --> 01:18:49.680
doesn't mean like, "Oh, let me.

1647
01:18:49.680 --> 01:18:51.620
"I don't want you to feel alone."

1648
01:18:52.390 --> 01:18:54.120
It is case by case

1649
01:18:54.120 --> 01:18:56.290
and I don't find myself kind of making

1650
01:18:56.290 --> 01:18:59.080
blanket decisions beforehand,

1651
01:18:59.080 --> 01:19:00.720
but I will also name things

1652
01:19:00.720 --> 01:19:02.520
that they may not be bringing up.

1653
01:19:02.520 --> 01:19:04.220
I was talking to someone
earlier about this

1654
01:19:04.220 --> 01:19:08.870
where I had those instance where this

1655
01:19:08.870 --> 01:19:13.400
young black teenager
male I was working with,

1656
01:19:13.400 --> 01:19:14.370
a lot of depression.

1657
01:19:14.370 --> 01:19:16.040
He was kind of signed in high school,

1658
01:19:16.040 --> 01:19:17.900
started to go to like job interviews.

1659
01:19:17.900 --> 01:19:20.510
His mom who was Black was like,

1660
01:19:20.510 --> 01:19:21.550
"I want you to look this way."

1661
01:19:21.550 --> 01:19:22.650
And he's like, "I want to look that way

1662
01:19:22.650 --> 01:19:23.850
"and this is fine, this is good enough."

1663
01:19:23.850 --> 01:19:25.180
"No, you need to have like a suit."

1664
01:19:25.180 --> 01:19:26.561
And he's like, "No, no."

1665
01:19:27.350 --> 01:19:30.350
Because I could name both

1666
01:19:30.350 --> 01:19:33.390
generationally what was happening

1667
01:19:33.390 --> 01:19:37.630
but also the pressures of
how Black people get seen

1668
01:19:37.630 --> 01:19:39.700
or taken seriously or not seriously

1669
01:19:39.700 --> 01:19:42.100
that's outside of their
particular dynamic,

1670
01:19:42.100 --> 01:19:44.590
was really important
for them also to hear.

1671
01:19:44.590 --> 01:19:47.500
So that they heard that
the issues were not just

1672
01:19:47.500 --> 01:19:50.540
because my mom feels this
way and I'm feeling this way

1673
01:19:50.540 --> 01:19:53.780
but you're getting all of
these messages everywhere

1674
01:19:53.780 --> 01:19:56.410
about how to be seen,
what's okay, what's not

1675
01:19:56.410 --> 01:19:58.320
and what decisions are gonna get made.

1676
01:19:58.320 --> 01:20:00.510
And how concrete those can be

1677
01:20:00.510 --> 01:20:02.590
and how life, not in this situation,

1678
01:20:02.590 --> 01:20:05.420
but how kind of life or
death things can also be.

1679
01:20:05.420 --> 01:20:07.910
Sometimes it's just like oh and you know,

1680
01:20:08.830 --> 01:20:09.830
this is outside.

1681
01:20:09.830 --> 01:20:13.530
Your depression is not just
some internal mechanism.

1682
01:20:13.530 --> 01:20:15.570
It's yeah, you're getting hit with racism,

1683
01:20:15.570 --> 01:20:19.400
the sexism and oppression
in addition to that.

1684
01:20:19.400 --> 01:20:21.740
So that's been a helpful thing for me

1685
01:20:21.740 --> 01:20:23.790
and hopefully for the people I work with.

1686
01:20:25.240 --> 01:20:26.960
- We'll take one more question.

1687
01:20:28.190 --> 01:20:28.840
- Can I answer?

1688
01:20:28.840 --> 01:20:30.430
- Yeah, oh sorry.

1689
01:20:35.490 --> 01:20:36.950
- Maybe I want to come at this

1690
01:20:36.950 --> 01:20:38.620
from another perspective.

1691
01:20:38.620 --> 01:20:41.320
I think that hopefully will be helpful.

1692
01:20:41.320 --> 01:20:43.860
One is even sort of the discourse

1693
01:20:43.860 --> 01:20:45.360
around what disclosure is

1694
01:20:45.360 --> 01:20:47.330
I think is an interesting one to consider.

1695
01:20:47.330 --> 01:20:49.770
For me particularly as I've located myself

1696
01:20:49.770 --> 01:20:51.500
as a Black woman particularly

1697
01:20:51.500 --> 01:20:55.110
from a Canadian Caribbean
African context that,

1698
01:20:55.110 --> 01:20:57.610
you know, sort of at
least some of the ways

1699
01:20:57.610 --> 01:21:00.180
that I was trained around disclosures is

1700
01:21:00.180 --> 01:21:02.050
this is something that I tell people,

1701
01:21:02.050 --> 01:21:04.680
that I, you know, of my own volition.

1702
01:21:04.680 --> 01:21:08.150
And yet, I've been a dark-skinned
Black woman my whole life

1703
01:21:08.150 --> 01:21:10.070
and this is a disclosure.

1704
01:21:14.320 --> 01:21:16.490
I think that that's an important piece

1705
01:21:16.490 --> 01:21:19.340
and particularly I think
it's important then

1706
01:21:19.340 --> 01:21:22.200
since there was a question
about sort of psychodynamic

1707
01:21:22.200 --> 01:21:24.600
and this is not limited
to psychodynamic theories,

1708
01:21:24.600 --> 01:21:27.070
but the way in which we also then harness

1709
01:21:27.070 --> 01:21:29.820
this idea around therapeutic neutrality.

1710
01:21:31.700 --> 01:21:34.480
For me there are some checks and balances

1711
01:21:34.480 --> 01:21:36.510
that happen around that in terms of

1712
01:21:36.510 --> 01:21:39.220
being able to make space
that it can be talked about

1713
01:21:39.220 --> 01:21:42.190
and that you know, I
don't generally ask folks

1714
01:21:42.190 --> 01:21:44.820
to sort of disclose if you're gonna use it

1715
01:21:44.820 --> 01:21:48.730
if I'm not prepared to also
be met with some curiosity.

1716
01:21:48.730 --> 01:21:50.360
And also to do that in an ethical way

1717
01:21:50.360 --> 01:21:51.930
that again is always in service

1718
01:21:51.930 --> 01:21:55.700
of the work we're doing, not
just some free styling, right?

1719
01:21:55.700 --> 01:21:56.830
But I think it's also important

1720
01:21:56.830 --> 01:21:59.340
to think about it sort of
systematically and structurally.

1721
01:21:59.340 --> 01:22:02.790
I think for me I'll give
you sort of an example from

1722
01:22:03.530 --> 01:22:06.640
my clinical work, I was
working in an outpatient,

1723
01:22:06.640 --> 01:22:08.900
a community-based outpatient clinic.

1724
01:22:11.670 --> 01:22:13.220
I'll give you sort of two examples

1725
01:22:13.220 --> 01:22:15.530
and one was that I'd been working with

1726
01:22:15.530 --> 01:22:18.920
a young White woman from
the middle class background

1727
01:22:18.920 --> 01:22:21.940
in New York where I live and I work.

1728
01:22:22.800 --> 01:22:24.960
Sort of six weeks into treatment

1729
01:22:24.960 --> 01:22:26.120
she dropped out of treatment

1730
01:22:26.120 --> 01:22:29.030
and there was this whole
protocol around no shows.

1731
01:22:29.030 --> 01:22:32.270
What was discovered by me after

1732
01:22:32.270 --> 01:22:33.670
some other unfortunate events

1733
01:22:33.670 --> 01:22:36.470
was that she had been transferred.

1734
01:22:36.470 --> 01:22:38.380
What was discovered sort
of in this conversation

1735
01:22:38.380 --> 01:22:40.100
about sort of how this transfer happened

1736
01:22:40.100 --> 01:22:41.780
particularly because there wasn't

1737
01:22:41.780 --> 01:22:44.910
any kind of continuity plan.

1738
01:22:44.910 --> 01:22:47.480
I felt strongly about some of
the ethics about how it was

1739
01:22:47.480 --> 01:22:49.650
but understanding sort
of where I was located

1740
01:22:49.650 --> 01:22:51.090
with respect to the power.

1741
01:22:51.090 --> 01:22:52.870
I asked about it.

1742
01:22:54.960 --> 01:22:56.790
The director sort of said,

1743
01:22:56.790 --> 01:22:59.580
"She wasn't comfortable with
you because you were Black."

1744
01:23:00.420 --> 01:23:02.270
What struck with me was I was Black

1745
01:23:02.270 --> 01:23:04.750
for the whole six weeks
that we worked together.

1746
01:23:06.430 --> 01:23:09.170
This wasn't something that was new.

1747
01:23:09.170 --> 01:23:11.840
(coughs) Excuse me.

1748
01:23:11.840 --> 01:23:13.140
But really I was.

1749
01:23:13.140 --> 01:23:15.110
(laughs)

1750
01:23:15.800 --> 01:23:18.320
That that was even a discussion...

1751
01:23:18.320 --> 01:23:21.690
It was not a discussion
with me as the clinician

1752
01:23:21.690 --> 01:23:23.850
and then that that was sort of

1753
01:23:23.850 --> 01:23:27.290
a seemingly appropriate
response from the director

1754
01:23:27.290 --> 01:23:29.260
was one in which like I became clear

1755
01:23:29.260 --> 01:23:31.940
about certain dynamics
that weren't operating.

1756
01:23:34.260 --> 01:23:36.430
The discussion sort of was directed

1757
01:23:36.430 --> 01:23:41.100
by my director at that time to this loss

1758
01:23:41.100 --> 01:23:43.140
and therefore it's sort
of an issue around billing

1759
01:23:43.140 --> 01:23:45.370
and level of volume and productivity.

1760
01:23:45.370 --> 01:23:47.480
She just said, "Well, you know Keshia,

1761
01:23:47.480 --> 01:23:48.980
"why don't you try asking your clients

1762
01:23:48.980 --> 01:23:51.480
"in your first intake
session (clears throat)

1763
01:23:51.480 --> 01:23:53.280
"if it's okay that you're Black."

1764
01:23:53.280 --> 01:23:55.080
(laughs)

1765
01:23:55.080 --> 01:23:56.470
Right.

1766
01:23:57.350 --> 01:23:58.890
And so there's many ways.

1767
01:23:59.380 --> 01:24:00.990
Again, this comes back
to the friction, right?

1768
01:24:00.990 --> 01:24:04.690
Let me say that I was water
in that moment to the fire.

1769
01:24:04.690 --> 01:24:06.360
(laughs)

1770
01:24:06.360 --> 01:24:08.270
(clapping)

1771
01:24:08.270 --> 01:24:11.300
I said to her respectfully, right?

1772
01:24:11.300 --> 01:24:14.640
Because I also know that in my locations

1773
01:24:14.640 --> 01:24:17.440
this was a very specific
power relationship

1774
01:24:17.440 --> 01:24:19.780
and that I was not necessary...

1775
01:24:19.780 --> 01:24:22.650
That there was a chance that
I was not gonna be afforded

1776
01:24:22.650 --> 01:24:24.510
kind of the same kind of things.

1777
01:24:24.510 --> 01:24:28.450
What I said was, "Well,
that's one possibility

1778
01:24:28.450 --> 01:24:30.820
"but I just want to be clear,

1779
01:24:30.820 --> 01:24:33.620
"do you ask all of your
clinicians in this clinic

1780
01:24:33.620 --> 01:24:36.490
"to ask if it's okay with
whoever they're working with

1781
01:24:36.490 --> 01:24:39.150
"to be however the identify racially?"

1782
01:24:39.600 --> 01:24:40.900
And she couldn't answer that

1783
01:24:40.900 --> 01:24:42.830
because the answer was obviously no.

1784
01:24:42.830 --> 01:24:44.790
And so I said so I want
to invite the possibility

1785
01:24:44.790 --> 01:24:47.090
of what the implications are gonna be

1786
01:24:48.060 --> 01:24:49.840
for me having to ask that.

1787
01:24:49.840 --> 01:24:51.810
And if then there are
going to be provisions

1788
01:24:51.810 --> 01:24:54.510
in place for my level of
volume and productivity.

1789
01:24:54.510 --> 01:24:57.260
And so in grounding it in that, right?

1790
01:24:57.260 --> 01:24:59.440
But I also want to be
clear about this last point

1791
01:24:59.440 --> 01:25:02.520
because then I was able to
have my enraged experience

1792
01:25:02.520 --> 01:25:04.590
with a trusted accountability partner

1793
01:25:04.590 --> 01:25:05.990
who could hold that space.

1794
01:25:05.990 --> 01:25:08.050
Because I also think it's really important

1795
01:25:08.050 --> 01:25:11.920
to be clear about the terrains
in which we move in, right?

1796
01:25:11.920 --> 01:25:15.960
And that it isn't all unicorns
and rainbows and meadows

1797
01:25:15.960 --> 01:25:19.190
although I love meadows
and unicorns and rainbows.

1798
01:25:20.360 --> 01:25:23.340
It was an issue where I
could take care of myself

1799
01:25:23.340 --> 01:25:25.510
and directly speak to the structures

1800
01:25:25.510 --> 01:25:26.610
that were in place, right?

1801
01:25:26.610 --> 01:25:30.070
The institutionalized racism
that was also then playing out.

1802
01:25:30.070 --> 01:25:31.450
I think that that's an important question

1803
01:25:31.450 --> 01:25:33.050
even around this disclosure piece

1804
01:25:33.050 --> 01:25:36.250
is again to what end for what purpose

1805
01:25:36.250 --> 01:25:40.520
and how can we then be cared for.

1806
01:25:40.520 --> 01:25:41.950
However that's sort of defined

1807
01:25:41.950 --> 01:25:44.040
within our professional structure.

1808
01:25:44.630 --> 01:25:47.030
(clapping)

1809
01:25:47.030 --> 01:25:51.490
- We would like to thank all
the presenters here today

1810
01:25:51.490 --> 01:25:53.170
and thank you so much for coming.

1811
01:25:53.170 --> 01:25:56.510
I apologize that there is
no more time for questions

1812
01:25:56.510 --> 01:25:58.640
but thanks so much for coming.

1813
01:25:58.640 --> 01:26:03.640
(clapping)

1814
01:26:08.720 --> 01:26:09.950
(laughs)

1815
01:26:09.950 --> 01:26:14.300
(clapping)

1816
01:26:14.300 --> 01:26:15.550
- [Kenta] That was wonderful.

1817
01:26:15.550 --> 01:26:16.720
- Thank you.

1818
01:26:16.720 --> 01:26:20.010
(clapping)